I’ve never heard of Fight club being a red flag. Probably it could be one if you’re overly obsessed with the movie, and express it with a focus on the toxic masculine parts of the movie, but in that case the issue is you being a red flag.
Some people do consider it a red flag, because there are idiots who misinterpret the movie and enough of them that interpret it as pro “toxic masculinity” that it’s scared a few people off. (Kinda like how 2019 Joker is a great film, but enough weirdos think it’s an endorsement of their weird behaviors.)
Like it’s a gay man’s satire of masculinity (and about the homoeroticism inherent to fascistic movements). It’s a joke. Notice how the narrator never wants to fuck Martha - that he spends late nights roaming, looking for other men to engage physically with. The fights are a cruising metaphor.
Fincher makes it even more obvious with the casting. Like yeah Helena Bingham Carter is hot, but we’re all here to gawk at Edward Norton and Brad Pitt.
I’ve only seen academic critique and of course more cerebral criticisms because of how they were reflections of their time, like many movies.
If you had actual people in real life attack you for liking these movies, either you were being weird about them and not listening to someone’s academic takes because you don’t understand them or you met a nut. Otherwise I think it’s bullshit and you just wanna be oppressed for liking [POPULAR THING]
As someone who knows far more about Menslib than I should probably say in the open, I can safely tell you that you need to get off the internet and not read gender-oriented material at all. Podcasts too. This is media, it’s meant to create conversations and most people don’t take it seriously. Or at least they shouldn’t.
The internet has this way of seeping into your head and making you think the constant barrage of sensationalism, of intrusive thoughts-turned-posts, of fake people pretending to be outraged, it makes you think all of this is any way how people actually view the world and it programs you to do the same.
I lived in the before-times, I know how people thought before. It wasn’t like this. When you’re not infected with the aimless thoughts of thousands of faceless voices in space, you can just enjoy what you enjoy and nobody cares. And if someone does care and not like a thing you like, you say “oh that’s too bad, I like it though.” And that was it. End of story. Those two people would then go on to like, get married and have a pile of kids because back then, we weren’t always looking for contention. That’s the other thing these spaces do, is make you aware of contention that doesn’t impact you and only serves to clutter up your mind.
This entire fetid mess is screwing up our minds, and then you take this screwed-up vision of the world and post it somewhere else, so the thousands hundreds of super-sensitive, sheltered Lemmy users read it and now all the tender boys here are wringing their hands over a non-issue as well and absolute nonsense spreads and spreads and spreads.
You like something? Like it. Stop trying to please people while at the same time stay respectful and kind and just get on with your day and life without excuses or hand-wringing about things that aren’t real.
I dunno’, if you ever knew a gossipy bitch in the-before-times, plenty of people were also judgemental assholes assuming the worst about everyone, from all angles and political slantings.
It was just less obvious, because you couldn’t go somewhere and read the thoughts from someone you’ll never meet back then unless it was published in a book or newspaper.
If you really get to understand humans, it turns out a lot of them genuinely do not have the capacity to judge others as individuals, and genuinely think they’re the good guy even while openly shitting on others. Even before the internet.
Note: I’m not saying this to excuse the behavior, but just to say that you cannot avoid it and it is not an invention of the internet. Learning to deal with it healthily is the correct answer.
I dunno’ man, cruise these comments. Plenty of people attempting to assume the worst even from those movies. Some people are just toxic judgemental assholes, even here on Lemmy.
How do you interpret and discuss Fight Club and Full Metal Jacket in conversation? I like both of these movies and have never had anyone respond negatively when I’ve discussed them.
When you talk about Fight Club, are you talking about it in a way which might suggest you think fight clubs are a good idea?
I’m trying to figure out who would have a problem with Full Metal Jacket.
If you talk about both of those movies in a way that acknowledges Sergeant Hartman and Tyler Durden are not people we should emulate, I don’t think many people would consider those red flags.
People who think that the those movies are red flags have probably met people who think that we are supposed to look up to those characters. If you make it clear that you are not one of those people, there’s not really a problem.
I think the angst in the original post is because some people really do jump to conclusions before even understanding why anything.
Sure, the comic in the main post is a red flag, but that’s mostly the sigma grindset BS. The Joker is an excellent example of judgemental guilt by association, at least if it were in isolation. What if someone likes putting up a good lesson on what not to do?
Like having a poster of Walter White, because he’s an excellently written and acted character that chose to go down a dark path? You’re not going to get the ‘why’ just by seeing a cool poster.
It’s just can be an ambiguous symbol, and if you are concerned about being misread, adding context can help.
I think the older analogues here are the kissing lesbians poster (I think it was from Spencer’s?) and A Clockwork Orange.
That “kissing lesbians” poster gave gooner vibes; that Orange gave “I’m the kind of film brah who’s only watched Kubrick.” There is nothing wrong with masturbating, but it’s not a personality. A Clockwork Orange is an excellent novel and film, but broadcasting a character who rapes someone to death (just in the movie, iirc) is going to be offputting. These are the notes that come first - but it’s entirely possible to put things in context in a way where people are less likely to see them as read flags.
Like, I have a lifelong fascination with Jonestown to the point that I own a vinyl pressing by his church’s choir. I am utterly incapable of not correcting the “koolaid” joke. I cannot start social interactions that I intend to turn romantic or sexual with Jonestown trivia - that is considered a massive faux pas. I lurked /b/ since roughly 2006; despite the fact that I am a fairly radical feminist, it would be a poor idea to wear a 4chan t-shirt.
However - once I put it in context - people usually are normal about it, and it can lead to interesting conversations. It’s okay for me to mention my Jim Jones vinyl if we are talking about collecting rare vinyl; it is okay for me to show off my copy of Sailor and the Seven Balls if I place it next to Chargeman Ken.
Yea, it’s a big reason I don’t display much. I tend to like the bad examples as warnings or otherwise weird/niche stuff in general, and I don’t like to peacock much anyways. So putting up something I’d have to explain is just not happening.
I just dislike very much people who jump to conclusions, at least in more nuanced cases than the OP comic, like your examples of the kissing lesbians and Clockwork Orange.
Fight Club and Full Metal Jacket to name two.
I’ve never heard of Fight club being a red flag. Probably it could be one if you’re overly obsessed with the movie, and express it with a focus on the toxic masculine parts of the movie, but in that case the issue is you being a red flag.
Some people do consider it a red flag, because there are idiots who misinterpret the movie and enough of them that interpret it as pro “toxic masculinity” that it’s scared a few people off. (Kinda like how 2019 Joker is a great film, but enough weirdos think it’s an endorsement of their weird behaviors.)
Like it’s a gay man’s satire of masculinity (and about the homoeroticism inherent to fascistic movements). It’s a joke. Notice how the narrator never wants to fuck Martha - that he spends late nights roaming, looking for other men to engage physically with. The fights are a cruising metaphor.
Fincher makes it even more obvious with the casting. Like yeah Helena Bingham Carter is hot, but we’re all here to gawk at Edward Norton and Brad Pitt.
Those are insanely popular movies.
I’ve only seen academic critique and of course more cerebral criticisms because of how they were reflections of their time, like many movies.
If you had actual people in real life attack you for liking these movies, either you were being weird about them and not listening to someone’s academic takes because you don’t understand them or you met a nut. Otherwise I think it’s bullshit and you just wanna be oppressed for liking [POPULAR THING]
I just don’t tell people I like them.
what the… then, how could you possibly be attacked for liking them?
Are you just creating things in your mind to feel bad about???
Because hear people talk about them.
Which people and where? I am dead serious, there is reason why I want to know.
I used to go to places like menslib on reddit. That shit was what was mostly talked about. It pops up in some of the podcasts I listen to.
As someone who knows far more about Menslib than I should probably say in the open, I can safely tell you that you need to get off the internet and not read gender-oriented material at all. Podcasts too. This is media, it’s meant to create conversations and most people don’t take it seriously. Or at least they shouldn’t.
The internet has this way of seeping into your head and making you think the constant barrage of sensationalism, of intrusive thoughts-turned-posts, of fake people pretending to be outraged, it makes you think all of this is any way how people actually view the world and it programs you to do the same.
I lived in the before-times, I know how people thought before. It wasn’t like this. When you’re not infected with the aimless thoughts of thousands of faceless voices in space, you can just enjoy what you enjoy and nobody cares. And if someone does care and not like a thing you like, you say “oh that’s too bad, I like it though.” And that was it. End of story. Those two people would then go on to like, get married and have a pile of kids because back then, we weren’t always looking for contention. That’s the other thing these spaces do, is make you aware of contention that doesn’t impact you and only serves to clutter up your mind.
This entire fetid mess is screwing up our minds, and then you take this screwed-up vision of the world and post it somewhere else, so the
thousandshundreds of super-sensitive, sheltered Lemmy users read it and now all the tender boys here are wringing their hands over a non-issue as well and absolute nonsense spreads and spreads and spreads.You like something? Like it. Stop trying to please people while at the same time stay respectful and kind and just get on with your day and life without excuses or hand-wringing about things that aren’t real.
I honestly feel like this is almost impossible.
I dunno’, if you ever knew a gossipy bitch in the-before-times, plenty of people were also judgemental assholes assuming the worst about everyone, from all angles and political slantings.
It was just less obvious, because you couldn’t go somewhere and read the thoughts from someone you’ll never meet back then unless it was published in a book or newspaper.
If you really get to understand humans, it turns out a lot of them genuinely do not have the capacity to judge others as individuals, and genuinely think they’re the good guy even while openly shitting on others. Even before the internet.
Note: I’m not saying this to excuse the behavior, but just to say that you cannot avoid it and it is not an invention of the internet. Learning to deal with it healthily is the correct answer.
Agree
I dunno’ man, cruise these comments. Plenty of people attempting to assume the worst even from those movies. Some people are just toxic judgemental assholes, even here on Lemmy.
How do you interpret and discuss Fight Club and Full Metal Jacket in conversation? I like both of these movies and have never had anyone respond negatively when I’ve discussed them.
When you talk about Fight Club, are you talking about it in a way which might suggest you think fight clubs are a good idea?
I’m trying to figure out who would have a problem with Full Metal Jacket.
It’s how other n people talk about it. They act like Hartman and Tyler were awesome bad asses and not the unhinged assholes they were.
If you talk about both of those movies in a way that acknowledges Sergeant Hartman and Tyler Durden are not people we should emulate, I don’t think many people would consider those red flags.
People who think that the those movies are red flags have probably met people who think that we are supposed to look up to those characters. If you make it clear that you are not one of those people, there’s not really a problem.
I think the angst in the original post is because some people really do jump to conclusions before even understanding why anything.
Sure, the comic in the main post is a red flag, but that’s mostly the sigma grindset BS. The Joker is an excellent example of judgemental guilt by association, at least if it were in isolation. What if someone likes putting up a good lesson on what not to do?
Like having a poster of Walter White, because he’s an excellently written and acted character that chose to go down a dark path? You’re not going to get the ‘why’ just by seeing a cool poster.
It’s just can be an ambiguous symbol, and if you are concerned about being misread, adding context can help.
I think the older analogues here are the kissing lesbians poster (I think it was from Spencer’s?) and A Clockwork Orange.
That “kissing lesbians” poster gave gooner vibes; that Orange gave “I’m the kind of film brah who’s only watched Kubrick.” There is nothing wrong with masturbating, but it’s not a personality. A Clockwork Orange is an excellent novel and film, but broadcasting a character who rapes someone to death (just in the movie, iirc) is going to be offputting. These are the notes that come first - but it’s entirely possible to put things in context in a way where people are less likely to see them as read flags.
Like, I have a lifelong fascination with Jonestown to the point that I own a vinyl pressing by his church’s choir. I am utterly incapable of not correcting the “koolaid” joke. I cannot start social interactions that I intend to turn romantic or sexual with Jonestown trivia - that is considered a massive faux pas. I lurked /b/ since roughly 2006; despite the fact that I am a fairly radical feminist, it would be a poor idea to wear a 4chan t-shirt.
However - once I put it in context - people usually are normal about it, and it can lead to interesting conversations. It’s okay for me to mention my Jim Jones vinyl if we are talking about collecting rare vinyl; it is okay for me to show off my copy of Sailor and the Seven Balls if I place it next to Chargeman Ken.
Yea, it’s a big reason I don’t display much. I tend to like the bad examples as warnings or otherwise weird/niche stuff in general, and I don’t like to peacock much anyways. So putting up something I’d have to explain is just not happening.
I just dislike very much people who jump to conclusions, at least in more nuanced cases than the OP comic, like your examples of the kissing lesbians and Clockwork Orange.
The same kind of person that would fuck somebody in the ass and not have the goddamn decency to give him a reach-around!