Eyewitness testimony reported Wednesday by Al Jazeera accused Israeli troops of massacring forcibly displaced women and children sheltering at a school in northern Gaza,
The Israeli soldiers came in and opened fire on them," one unidentified witness said. “They took all men, then entered classrooms and opened fire on a woman and all the children with her,” including “newborn children.”
“The Israeli soldiers executed those innocent families point-blank,” she added.
A man who arrived at the scene after the alleged mass murder told Al Jazeera that “we found dozens of dead bodies in the classrooms.”
“There is no sign of any missiles or shells,” he added. “All those who were in the buildings were executed from point-blank. The Israeli soldiers opened fire on them. Many families came searching for their children. They found them all killed. They were all killed, executed at gunpoint.”
It is irresponsible to publish such serious accusations without verification.
Hey sorry, I’m just a bit curious about when you developed this strongly held view as it seems at odds with your previous posts?
Like for instance here where you readily accepted Israel’s claims about Ibrahim Biari being in the refugee camp they bombed without independent verification?
I’m guessing some profound and enlightening experience in this past month has convinced you to be more critical of news sources and your previous comment has nothing to do with your support of Israel’s actions such as your genocide denial or making excuses for why bombing a refugee camp was actually okay.
It just feels like your comment was made in bad-faith here, but I’m sure it was well intended.
Stalker!
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Seriously haha. These squares follow every single thing you lot say and if any of it wavers, full blown crazy behaviour.
The best part is being downvoted from all their alts and brigading gross propagandists lol.
Low effort concern trolling is insidious bs though.
Check my comments. I didn’t post on any of this thread yet and I don’t have alts, but I downvoted both of you in this absolutely dumb exchange. I don’t think that’s brigading or trolling.
If you get your hypocrisy called out, shouting and pointing stalker doesn’t mean you’re suddenly not a hypocrite.
Same same. Some copium being smoked.
Homie, if you don’t think every Israel/Hamas thread isn’t brigaded to hell and back on a popular, mostly unmoderated, & federated instance, then you’ll be gobsmacked the moment you say anything remotely based in reality lol.
People just want to have their upvote and downvote circlejerks depending on whether it’s Pro-Israel/IDF or Pro-Palestine/Hamas. It’s no different than reddit, and just like there, the points often don’t matter.
Yeah no, you are being downvoted because you are not adding anything useful to the thread, no big conspiracy here
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I was debating on telling them that but I feel like some people need to pick up the cat by it’s tail to learn their lesson, not sure how convincing I could be myself.
A five paragraph diatribe over a nuanced topic when nothing OP said was odd is the dickhead propagandist behavior lol.
Calling people out on it isn’t some enlightened centrist status quo. It’s one guy wasting five paragraphs to say ‘Oh you can change your mind with new info!?’
That’s fucking hilarious weird stalker shit for Lemmy. Congrats! You got him dude!
I admit that that comment was flippant, but you’ll note that I said “apparently” there. I admit that Ibrahim Biari’s death has still not been confirmed, although I’m also unaware of any strong evidence that he is still alive.
With that said, I do think that Israel’s claim is less difficult to believe. It wouldn’t be surprising that a specific person Israel wants dead would be among the many people killed in that bombing, whereas it would be surprising if Israeli soldiers executed a group of women and children, at least because doing that would be absolutely terrible for Israel’s international relations. Even countries which accept that civilians will be killed by bombing aren’t going to support deliberate murder.
I’m not saying it’s impossible. Soldiers do things like that sometimes. I am saying it’s unlikely enough that commondreams.org shouldn’t be publishing what is effectively still just a rumor.
Lol.
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What would independent verification mean on this? Who would qualify as independent that could reach the scene and evaluate it? At some point you can’t just decide that since the invading and allegedly responsible power doesn’t allow international investigations then no potential crime can ever be responsibly reported.
Do you think that statement should not have been included in the article?
What statement? I think that it hasn’t been independently verified is essential, because it’s true, but the person I responded to wanted the entire story to not be published.
I didn’t understand the point you were trying to make. Thank you for clarifying.
I watched the video from Al Jazeera. There are blurred sections, but at no point does it show blood or anything that is unambiguously a human body. I don’t expect that corpses with gunshot wounds would be broadcast on TV, but that still leaves commondreams.org with no evidence beyond several brief interviews filmed by Al Jazeera. I do expect that if this event took place, impartial news agencies would have access to uncensored images of the aftermath. I’m going to wait and see if the New York Times publishes something.
So, what you’re saying is that there’s enough ground to believe that this news organization, Al Jazeera, has fabricated dead bodies. The journalist team blurred a pile of puppets or something and went on-air, lying they’re human bodies. That’s an interesting take…
Alright, I’m out. I have nothing more to say to you.
Sounds 100% like what AJ would do.
I won’t believe it without unblurred pictures. It’s not that hard; links to gory pictures should be included with a warning in these kinds of articles.
I’d think it’s hard enough to acquire pictures from a war zone…
Yes, but they already have them. They could just publish the footage without editing it. The footage already does look compelling, but it would be better if it was unblurred.
Contwct them and ask for the unblurred videos.
Are you being serious here? It would be much better if the videos weren’t edited. It would leave too little room for doubt.
What’s the worst that could happen? They’re journalists. Ask them nicely. Make sure to let them know it’s because you don’t trust their journalism.
I do trust Al-Jazeera’s journalism generally, but I will hold them to the same standards we usually hold western media to. These images look more compelling as evidence than most of the pro-“Israeli” media’s evidence, but if Al-Jazeera really wants to convince people who are biased in favor of “Israel” or the US, then it must release unedited images, video clips, and audio clips.
Holding the media outlets on your side to a high standard will benefit you in the long term.
Remember that many people still actually believe that the occupations militia never explicitly targeted civilians. These articles are the perfect thing to point to, and they should be backed by as much evidence as possible.
As for the funii request, I may try to contact Al-Jazeera tomorrow and will ask them to include the footage like they usually do.
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Criticism of Israel is not praise for Hamas. The IDF and Hamas both deserve nothing but the sharpest condemnations. Both are a blight on the Palestinians.
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You’ll find crazies wherever you go. I’ve argued against those same people too and pointed out to them that Hamas isn’t the rebel army for Palestinians. They cause great harm to the civilians too.
Lumping all criticism of Israel together with pro Hamas drivel only benefits Hamas. That’s what they want, to build legitimacy and hate towards Israel. You’re doing their dirty work for them. If you actually want to oppose them, call out the specific, explicit instances. Don’t rail against a Palestinian protest group – rail against the terrorist supporters who are trying to disguise themselves.
The IDF is wrong for killing innocent people. Hamas is wrong for killing innocent people. Neither of them are justified in it. Anyone who cannot accept all these statements is a bigot in some way and should be condemned.
Also, there seems to be very direct links between Netanyahu and Hamas. The NYT just reported the other day that Israeli officials allowed suitcases of money to go Palestine for Hamas to seize. Netanyahu used them to get into power and stay in power.
Hamas bases under hospitals, 40 beheaded babies and mass rape allegations against Hamas sure didn’t need independent verification.
When it’s IDF propaganda any developing story can go on the most “reputable site” . But a story against Israel? High press standards activated!
Aljazeera doesn’t just make up stories there’s a high probability that there is truth to this since those people didn’t just randomly die on their own and the IDF did raid the place.
It’s worth pointing out that “Al Jazeera says after interviewing witnesses” is also very different from “the IDF says”. One is a news organization that’s known for generally being neutral. The other is literally one of the combatants. If anything, we should be holding the IDF to a higher standard.
Not to mention this is fairly easy to validate and confirm. The reporters who did the interviews will have transcripts and notes from it. They can release those without breaking privacy or identifying anyone, and if the notes tell the same story, it’s unlikely to be fabricated.
AJ is about as neutral as Hamas is in this war.
There were bases under the hospitals
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Can you link me a single piece of evidence of Hamas doing this?
I can only seem find these kinds of acts being committed by the IDF all the time.
A whole list of articles including one from even a decade ago of the IDF forcing a 9 year old civilian Palestinian boy to open a suspected IED bag.
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2010/nov/21/israeli-soldiers-human-shield-avoid-jail
With the photographic evidence to back it up damn…
Fucked up photo.
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“Since the beginning of the occupation in 1967, Israeli security forces have repeatedly used Palestinians in the West Bank and in the Gaza Strip as human shields, ordering them to perform military tasks that risked their lives. As part of this policy, soldiers have ordered Palestinian civilians to remove suspicious objects from roads, to tell people to come out of their homes so the military can arrest them, to stand in front of soldiers while the latter shoot from behind them, and more. The Palestinian civilians were chosen at random for these tasks, and could not refuse the demand placed on them by armed soldiers.”
You can read a lot more about it here
https://www.btselem.org/human_shields
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Replied to the wrong comment?
Looks more like the IDF trying to use him as a “human shield,” eh. I guess the Israelis learned that trick from their nazi friends, huh?
I have noticed this trend of whatever Israel is accusing others of perpetuating, it is usually heavily involved in itself.
Seems that solider in 2008 is keeping the man behind the concrete partition. Does that look like a human shield? As for the boy, The amazing life and deeds of Mohammed Badwan – The Human Shield Amazing how he’s remained 13 years old for the last 20 years!
Hamas are terrorists. Their regime ends now.
Hope you’re getting paid for this level of cognitive dissonance.
I’m still waiting for you to link me that evidence of Hamas using human shields like the IDF has done a gazillion times
Oh look… the White Supremacist Israel Fan Club decided to show up.
Yawn.
Do you not know more than those few English words? You attempted to dunk on us, exhibited the fact that you literally don’t know a single thing about the Palestinian/Israeli conflict, and then repeated yourself. Bravo.
It seems that soon hamas will be completely neutralized. How do you like that? Not much you can do about it huh.
Sorry pal. Hope you get over it some day
Yeah… no, that’s not what’s going to happen. Unless Israel kills every palestinian and even then, a lot of the hamas leaders aren’t even in gaza, so, they will just start a new one. You may want to take a deep breath, get some fresh air, and stop reading and listening to fear driven news sources.
Hopefully they will. In the mean time looks like ya boys are getting rounded up all over the world.
Hopefully they will what?
Also, my boys?
You ok there?
(get all Hamas)
Israel claims they still need “months if not years” so it doesn’t look like they’re making any progress actually killing any Hamas members
Like accusations of charred babies.
‘Twas decapitated not charred.
They showed pictures of charred.
They published unverified IDF claims all the time.
Which was also wrong.
Don’t forget to post this on all the jpost/timesofisrael testimonies.
They can publish witness accounts.
Yeah, but think of the clicks! All those juicy, juicy clicks!
Like the murdered Israeli babies, maybe.
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Did you know, there are more Semitic people who aren’t Jews?
Antisemitism is a misnomer, yes. It is referring specifically to the hatred of Jews, not semitic people in general.
The term originated around 1879, when it got popularized by a group of fantics around German journalist Wilhelm Marr by founding the “Antisemiten-Liga” (league of antisemitics). And since these guys were not the brightest, they got that detail wrong.
The term was subsequently used by Nazi Germany and they didn’t correct the inital misnomer either, so now we are stuck with that, I guess.
Like the Palestinians?
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You’re completely mistaken. Here’s the timeline.
Romans conquer Jerusalem. Jews were oppressed and discriminated against. The area is largely Jewish.
Western Roman Empire falls. Eastern Roman Empire, Byzantines, hold Jerusalem. Christians from Western Europe move to Jerusalem. The majority of the area is now Christian. Scholars seem to think it went from majority Jewish to Christian a bit after Constantine converted to Christianity. Judaism is the only non Christian religion tolerated, but Jews still face discrimination and oppression.
Byzantine - Sasanian War begins. The Jewish community revolts against the Byzantines and helps the Persians conquer Jerusalem.
Jews rule autonomously for a few years, then Persia reneges on their alliance. The Byzantine emperor promises to restore Jewish rights as part of an alliance, and the Jews help oust the Persians. The emperor goes back on his word and orders a massacre of the Jews. The Jewish population is heavily reduced, with some fleeing to Egypt.
The Rashidun Caliphate (Arabs) conquer Jerusalem. There’s a brief period of peace and prosperity. The land is initially majority Jewish or Samaritan, but slowly becomes an Arab majority as Arabs move there. This begins in the year 638 and ends in 717 when there were new laws oppressing and discriminating against Jews. This, and a series of Muslim civil wars, causes the Jews to leave. There’s a substantial reduction in the Jewish population.
The Crusades begin. Jews and Muslims alike are enslaved and killed by the crusaders. The majority of the Jewish population is killed in the Siege of Jerusalem, and the survivors sold as slaves.
The Ayyubid Dynasty drives away the Crusaders. There is peace, and some Jews return
The Ayyubid Dynasty is overthrown by the Mamluk Empire. They heavily oppress the Jews and Christians, and through mismanagement, usher in significant economic decline. A lot of Jews leave.
The Ottoman Empire conquers the region, and there is relative peace and stability.
So who stole the land? Who drove off and killed the Jewish residents? In order, it seems the Romans, Byzantines, Persians, Byzantines again, Arabs, Christian crusaders, and Mamluk. The Ottomans control the area into the modern era.
Europeans were largely the ones who stole this land and killed the Jews who lived there. Some Muslims did as well, and some other Muslims helped the Jews for some time.
Next time I suggest actually understanding the history before running your mouth like a fool.
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You do know that Israel gained land in those conflicts?
Oh, look… the white supremacists running interference for a kapo state wants to accuse everybody else of being “antisemites.”
Yawn.
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Oh, look… the white supremacists are still trying to deflect attention from their rabid white supremacism by accusing everybody else of being white supremacists.
Yawn.