Never thought I live to see someone fuck up worse than Bush Jr.
He just got the US into a war where there’s nothing to gain, zero upsides other than bending the k we to Israel.
fuck up worse than Bush Jr
Trump is an enemy to the US. He isn’t fucking up, we’re letting him succeed.
We are only 6 months in…… fuck us
Musta missed 2019 when the US was caught with their pants down during a global pandemic, despite having a pandemic plan in place just a few years prior. Ultimately ended up killing over a million Americans… And the guy got re-elected.
two things can be shite at once buddy.
No one said otherwise.
The original commenter said they hadn’t seen anyone fuck up this bad since Bush. The responder is simply implying that they think the covid response was an equally bad fuck up.
that’s not the math I took from it. but, fair point, I reckon.
I was kinda hoping the US would collapse into civil war before they helped start WW3.
Bugger.
The drives too long for your average US Citizen. at least that was the common excuse on the other site. “Drive is too long to DC” or “I have a job that’s tied to my medical insurance” Best they could do was ONE day of protest. On a Saturday.
We can do both.
Yankee go home. And stay there.
When the corporations start dividing your population and guaranteeing their own interests over democracy, look at what happened to us and learn from it. It doesn’t stop here.
We need to remove this cyst of an administration before they start WW3
deleted by creator
I have to say, the one good part of Trump in office is at least you lot aren’t lecturing people on why invading Iran is good, actually!
deleted by creator
Man, you Americans really do think everything is some foreigner’s fault?
deleted by creator
The fact that you think the constant whining and blamecasting at nobody in particular constitutes a callout speaks volumes. And the fact that your first resort on being challenged is a barrage of insults speaks even more. Someone more intellectually minded might even use it as a jumping off point for some introspection, or see the parallel with US politics in general and foreign policy in particular - but, of course, that would risk recognizing the nose and rainbow hair as the reflection in the window pane that they are.
Honk-honk, Buttons. Honk-honk.
deleted by creator
- W. Bush says Iran is in Axis of Evil bullshit basically telling Iran “you’re next!” while invading Iraq. Iran starts a nuclear program in response.
- Obama fixed things by making a treaty with Iran, and got the Nobel Peace Prize (though not in that order which was a bit weird, but whatever)
- Trump cancels that treaty and assassinates an Iranian General
- Biden tries to restore the Obama treaty, but Iran doesn’t trust the US (wonder why?). So no treaty, but also no war with Iran.
- Trump gets in again drops some really big bombs on Iran
“BOTH SIDES!” say both the MAGAs and leftists in unison.
Yeah, you’re right. I’m sure the Democrats would not have supported Israel in Iran, same as how they didn’t support Israel in Yemen, or in Lebanon, or in Gaza, or in Syria, or in…
You’re doing the leftist reductive thing so complex issues become a simplistic “it’s all the system, man…”
This doesn’t make you look as clever as you think it does. It’ll eventually turn you into a conspiracy nut where everything is because of “them”. Please make an effort to stay on topic.
Oh, it’s not the “system, man”, it’s you. As in, you, @[email protected], personally. You are the exact person I’m thinking about when I say this, and it’s frankly amazing you decided to throw your hat in ring here, while simultaneously defending attacks on Iran elsewhere.
Removed by mod
Do you deny that Iran is committing genocide. Then you’re the genocide denialist!
Or maybe we shouldn’t weaponize the word genocide and discuss serious issues like adults instead of playing word games?
Removed by mod
Removed by mod
If Kamala had won, I (trans latina) would not have had to flee the US. But they’re both the exact same amirite? (I’m honestly a little grateful for that. The US is trash. I’m never moving back)
Edit: my point is that people are literally fleeing the US because it’s a sinking ship. Under Kamala, immigration and tourism wouldn’t have changed much
…Here’s a thought exercise for you: The year is 2028, Trump is running for a third term, and the Dem ticket is… IDK, Newsom/Buttigieg or whatever, and the big thinkers of the DNC have come up with a foolproof plan to steal away MAGA voters: they will agree with exterminating trans people, but! BUT! will firmly, and I mean FIRMLY stand behind gay marriage. And you’re trying to explain that both of those choices are unacceptable to you, and in response are met with an avalanche of mockery because “sure, yeah, one side wants gay marriage banned, but they’re both the exact same amirite?”
Seriously, though, best of luck. Not to assume stuff about your situation, but getting out sooner rather than later sounds like a good move.
deleted by creator
“I would be alright”.
Removed by mod
Obama fixed things by making a treaty with Iran, and got the Nobel Peace Prize (though not in that order which was a bit weird, but whatever)
I don’t understand how anyone could be so blatant about their own mental gymnastics.
Are you not aware of the treaty? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Joint_Comprehensive_Plan_of_Action
Or are you not aware that Obama won the Noble Peace Prize?
Or maybe you just don’t have a sense of humour so you think a joke about Obama getting the Nobel Prize before doing the treaty is “mental gymnastics”?
Ah, sorry a lot of folks here are getting a bit wacky with apologia, and I could see them actually putting forward the nobel peace price as an argument for Obama not being a war criminal, so I did take it a bit too seriously. Poe’s law I guess. My apologies!
That said, he is a war criminal though, and I feel like you’re cherry picking little bits out of all the presidencies to confirm your point.
Here’s an example in the other direction, maybe it’ll help you see how unconvincing an argument you’re making:
- Clinton: illegal bombing of Yugoslavia, sanctions in Iraq that have been estimated to kill 500k children.
- Obama accelerated the drone program, killing 10s of thousands of Afghanis. Under his leadership, and entire wedding party was murdered in Yemen. Pledged 3.8 billion dollars a year for a decade in military aid to the apartheid ethnostate Israel as they were regularly bombing the Gaza strip. Pledged not to persecute the CIA operarives who carried out the torture of uncharged civilians.
- Trump withdrew from Afghanistan.
- Biden sent 17.9 billion dollars in nilitary aid to Israel as they were carrying out the genocide in Gaza. Bombed Syria.
You’ll note that I omitted Bush. He was really bad. Like, Hitler bad. Not a redeeming quality about him.
At any rate the point is that every single president since Eisenhower, every single one, no exceptions, has been a war criminal, and pretending that any one of them was pro peace is a joke.
Yeah sure. Kamala would never support Israel. Y’all are so braindead lol.
deleted by creator
I’m not an American so what I see maybe different than what you see. But you know you would be lying if you say US would just allow iran to bomb tel aviv and sit watching. Both sides may not be same but both of em are held by balls by Israel.
deleted by creator
None of that is about intervening in the war. Do better.
deleted by creator
You might actually be slow. You are the one that’s being irrelevant. Anyways you made up your mind. I can’t change it. Like it or not Israel is your president. Kiss their boots like you have been doing for the last century
Ugh. This kind of hits hard.
I know people who are active in the military (yes they are stupid and yes it doesn’t take much analysis to figure out they’re probably magats). In particular I know several who have been to Kuwait and seem to regularly get stationed there.
I’ve known several people who died by suicide from PTSD from Kuwait, or Iraq.
There’s a girl, she’s a sergeant. She’s in until 2028, been to Kuwait already. I don’t know if she’s even 23. She certainly doesn’t come off as a magat. But it doesn’t really matter. 23 is an adult yes. But to me? I’m 34? She’s just starting life out. To get killed in this kind of war is gross.
There’s fucking nothing traumatic happening in Kuwait right now. Or in that last 20 years for that matter. Get your head out of your ass. What is this bullshit pulling on your heartstrings fearmongering nonsense comment. “She’s been to Kuwait already” dumbass I’ve been to all the bases in Kuwait multiple times it’s chill. They train and they have a taco bell. It’s admin HQ for operations nearby
The PTSD folk? They were in the expelling force in '91. The others were in Iraq (mainly after 2003), and came through Kuwait.
Kuwait was chill after the Iraq regime fell.
Kuwait is right over the Persian Gulf by Iran. It won’t be chill for very long.
Of course the PTSD folks went through it. Though I am arguing with you I want to make it clear I meant zero disrespect or antagonization for anyone who lived through that as part of the expelling force. I was there as a citizen. My point was that your comment made it seem as if Kuwait has been a hot zone in between those times and I got upset and perhaps reacted poorly.
Oh, no, not at all. It’s purely about its location and importance than worry me.
deleted by creator
So usa dropping another 1 trillion and 20 years for nothing?
What do you mean nothing, think of all the billionaires adding more billions to their bank accounts, isn’t that what this country is all about
The American war machine was getting light pocketbooks. Gotta start another conflict.
Yea, the American MIC stocks are getting outpaced by European ones, we gotta start a new war to make the stocks up!
We spent way more than one Trillion…
Im sure it will trickle back anyday now…any… day…
What do you mean for nothing? That’s $1Tril going to Trump’s buddies! /s
Defense contractors after hearing the bombings:
It’s called efficiency, look it up.
Fuck all you Trumpers, this is your fault
Hello world war 3.
It’s being nice knowing you, humans
Doesn’t a world war require someone backing Iran? Or do you mean “the whole world vs Iran”?
Russia is busy, Hamas is not available, Hisbollah is not available, Syria is not interested anymore, Huthis will send a few rockets again…
This could very easily spiral into a full-on WW3 scenario. Note, WW3 may not look like what you expect it to look like. We’ve been culturally conditioned to think WW3 will look like thousands of mushroom clouds over major cities, but that need not be the case. WW3 could be a large conventional war just like the previous world wars.
Russia is already bogged down in Ukraine, and the US and NATO are supplying them. Israel is at war with a half a dozen countries, and the US is supporting them, including directly entering the war on Iran. The danger of WW3 lies is revealed when you ask, why did Israel choose this time to attack Iran? They chose to because now was simply the perfect opportunity. With Iran’s proxy fighters around Israel devastated, with the Gaza a smoking ruin, Iranian power is lower than it has been in years. That’s why they decided to do this now - kick them while they’re down.
Us getting bogged down in Iran, however, presents other countries with their own windows of opportunity. And the biggest one is China invading Taiwan. China has been saber-rattling and openly planning an invasion of Taiwan, to be done at some point in the next few years. What better time to launch it than when the US has already been depleting their limited weapon stocks in Ukraine, and just got bogged down in Iran?
China is already involved in the Ukraine conflict; they’re one of Russia’s biggest suppliers. Iran also is a Russian ally, providing them thousands of drones. The alliance system of a potential world war is already laid out. It would be Russia/Iran/China vs the US, NATO, and assorted allies.
This would be unlikely to end up in a full nuclear exchange. Direct invasion of the homelands of Russia, China, or the US are not going to happen. But we could see multiple large conventional armed conflicts breaking out in multiple theaters, a conflict between two vast alliance systems that between them encompass most of the world’s population.
If that isn’t a world war, I don’t know what is. Nukes don’t need to fly to have a conflict that leaves millions dead.
US weapons stockpiles aren’t depleted in the slightest. You guys sent your old stuff to Ukraine and not much more, and you haven’t sent anything substantial in over a year.
Iran will, most likely, not involve more than an air campaign and the US can do that with a bomber wing and a carrier strike group. I can’t imagine a case where this evolves into a full invasion (but of course with trump you can never be sure).
If anything, seeing Iran getting dominated by Israel and the US would probably give China some doubts about a possible operation against Taiwan.
Us getting bogged down in Iran, however, presents other countries with their own windows of opportunity. And the biggest one is China invading Taiwan. China has been saber-rattling and openly planning an invasion of Taiwan, to be done at some point in the next few years. What better time to launch it than when the US has already been depleting their limited weapon stocks in Ukraine, and just got bogged down in Iran?
IMO, there is a lot of conjuntive in it.
For now, there were only bombs on nuclear facilities from the US side… No foot troops getting bogged down. Nothing getting bogged down for now…
You can always imagine how something could link to a word war. That would have already worked for Ukraine. That would have worked with Afghanistan as well.
The question is how realistic it is. I’m not a fan of painting the devil on the wall by declaring WW3 myself on Lemmy and saying goodbye to others…
It would be Russia/Iran/China vs the US, NATO, and assorted allies.
I honestly don’t think the US has its traditional allies any more. Why should Canada get involved in defense of a bully who is threatening to invade it?
Israel is the third variable in the equation since everyone is subservient to it, so who knows what will happen there
Why should Canada get involved in defense of a bully who is threatening to invade it?
Precisely so it doesn’t end up on the wrong side and end up getting invaded.
Well. China will invade Taiwan, pearl harbouring us bases in Japan before hand.
Bada Bing. Bada boom. Shooting war starts
When China invades Taiwan, that itself has a lot of potential for escalation. Bada Bing. Bada boom. Iran might be completely irrelevant in such a war.
How is Iran even a factor in that case then?
How was tiny little Serbia a factor triggering WW1?
Little things spiral into bigger things, which then spiral into yet bigger things.
The US is going to war with Iran on behalf of Israel. Russia is at war with Ukraine. Russia is Iran’s ally. The US thinks it’s Russia’s ally. The EU is supposed to be helping Ukraine. Israel is on a conquest mission, backed by the US, to colonize the Middle East. India and Pakistan have their thing going on. The US is threatening to invade Mexico, Canada, and Greenland. And that’s just a small slice of the world.
Do you not see how this can easily spiral into an absolute clusterfuck?
Pakistan could back Iran while India backs Israel. It has the potential to escalate.
There is never 0 potential for escalation in a world political context. The question is how realistic it is…
And Pakistan and Iran are not really best buddies. There is also the potential of them attacking each other. https://edition.cnn.com/2024/01/18/world/iran-pakistan-attacks-tensions-explainer-intl-hnk/index.html
Furthermore: From a few weeks ago, we already know that it doesn’t need Iran for India and Pakistan to attack each other… Last time, it did not end in a world war.
Happy 3rd war in the Middle East everyone!
Removed by mod
Hey dude, we didn’t all vote for him
You remember when Russia invaded Ukraine, and the whole western world collectively decided being Russian made you ontologically evil?
Well, that.
You mean the 1.000.000 russians who went to war? Yeah they were evil. The basic vatnic I don’t know. Putin and the Kremlin for sure.
I’m gonna need the world to do this to us Americans after this. Make us a pariah state. Toxic. Radioactive even. The announcement of joining hands with the US or US Corporations should be met with broad condemnations and a revisiting of treaties.
No, no we did not. Actions by a state doesn’t justify collectively dehumanising an entire population. Gazans didn’t become inherently evil because Hamas did October 7, Chinese aren’t inherently evil because of the Uighur Genocide, Russians aren’t inherently evil because of the invasion of Ukraine…
You may think that now, but I distinctly remember the then-prime minister of Estonia and current vice-president of the EC honouring a summit where the participants were carrying around a blow-up shark. Why a shark? Well, a random Russian tourist got killed in a shark attack some time earlier, and, well, dead Russian, ha-ha.
It’s good to see the sentiment has receded somewhat, but it is concerning that it literally took the tables turning to get people to self-reflect.
Collectively Russian are good people. It’s all Putin’s fault.
Some of them have.
When it comes to democracy in foreign countries usa always go all in war, bombing civilians… but when it comes to their own democracy they are to scared they will do/say something that will get them cancelled
Democracy was not even mentioned by any one in the orange mans administration. The us is well past such excuses.
The US empire is a cancer on humanity
Almost every American just wants to stay home and play video games, we didn’t want any of this. We wanted healthcare.
I fully agree: Americans need to liberate themselves from the chains of their government. Join a local socialist organization, mutual aid, or union
They should vote that way then, being dumbasses serves no-one good
Hey dude, we didn’t all vote for him
Half of you did. What a dumb nation
You’re right, and what you need to understand is that the reason half of our idiots voted for an idiot is because we allowed corporations to atomize society so people didn’t mix anymore, we don’t have shared perspectives of the world anymore, everyone gets their information about literally everything algorithmically. This atomization of society is what took down the USA and it’s coming for you next if it’s not already happening wherever you are.
Not even close half, us democracy is a joke that loser can win and not everyone gets to vote. 22,5% of US population voted for trump. That is still way too much, but it is still minority.
These young kids are a waste of life…
I said empire, not president. Dems aren’t opposing the war.
Trump didn’t seek congressional approval before the strike.
He doesn’t have to, if it’s an “emergency”.
And how have democrat politicians responded?
The other half voted for Biden (yes, I know, different election, but they did, minus rounding errors). 17.8 billion in military aid to Israel under his leadership, in addition to the 3.8 billion a year for an entire decade that Obama set up. It is not the president, it’s not the GOP, it’s the country. When Harris bragged at the DNC that she would make the US military the most lethal fighting force on the planet, do you feel like she was implying that she would have them sit on their hands?
Anyone who still thinks Trump is to blame just isn’t paying attention.
These strikes would’ve happened no matter who the president was it’s a geopolitical inevitability.
And yes, it’s becoming increasingly clear that Ukraine is in serious trouble now.
I’m waiting to see if Trump/pentagon escalates or does their strike package and goes home.
I doubt this is going to lead to some sort of ground invasion. Biden would have done the exact same although maybe more clandestine.
What ground invasion lol, americans have zero chance invading Iran.
Iran and its allies and proxies have to retaliate against US positions in the region. If Iran doesnt respond, they will be considered fair game for bombing whenever the US and Israel are bored. Both US and Israel just proved that diplomacy is off the table with them. Neither country speaks any language but violence.
I don’t know if they can, honestly. Iran has lost air superiority in their own skies as well as, reportedly, a majority of their long range missile launch sites. US bases in the near gulf states might be in range of Irans short range arsenal, but do they really want a strike into their neighbors territory? We’ll see.
yes!
Taiwan and South Korea probably shittting their pants right about now as well. Daddy’s about to be too busy to help out when their possed off neightcome knocking
They’ll be next — just not immediately. Over the next couple of years, Ukraine will likely be partitioned, and as the war with Iran de-escalates, a new conflict will be needed to fill the vacuum. That’s how the cycle tends to work.
