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Tinder and the other apps are pretty bad. Partly because they want to make money, not matches.
But also partly because the users suck at using them. People are like “I want interesting conversation” but reply with nothing but “lol”. Come in my dude put some work in.
But also partly because the users suck at using them. People are like “I want interesting conversation” but reply with nothing but “lol”.
A lot of profiles on these sites are entirely fake or bot-operated, to boost the impression that you’re getting matches. Some profiles are run by data miners who swipe match on everyone just to get the additional data that comes with a match. Others are run by businesses that are using the profiles for promotion.
Slapping “I want interesting conversation” in the profile is a great way to bait engagement, but more often than not there’s no dating prospect on the other side of the profile. This isn’t a string of incredibly vapid women you’re running into, its dummy accounts and scams.
Somehow I hadn’t even considered fake profiles. I don’t know if that makes me feel better or worse about the situation.
My coworker told me that even restaurants will post “profiles”, get matches and set up first dates at their establishments. The person will obviously get stood up, but they are more likely to spend money in the establishment since they’re already there. Like maybe a drink or 2.
Now that’s evil.
As someone who has been stood up consecutively 16 times. What a monsterous way to acquire business
Better about your future potential dating pool but worse about the tech industry is where I went with it.
There’s a cute little audiobook I listened to recently, called “The Verifiers” which was written by a person who worked professionally in the dating app industry and turned her experience into a thriller novel. Definitely made me feel better about getting the run around, since this is apparently the professional standard and not just me being uniquely stupid.
yup if any dating service needs you to pay a subscription instead of a one time payment and it helps you until you succeed, they have an active incentive to keep you as a customer as long as possible and guess what makes you stop being a customer.
Weirdly, none of them really focus on the non-monogamous market. There’s a section of likely long term users.
I’m not someone remotely into that market, but my understanding is there isn’t a huge demand for this outside the Ashley Madison type who are cheating. The various cliques have their own methods of finding each other and generally aren’t interested in broadcasting that to a wider market.
A lot of the polyamorous people I know are on the apps or have tried them, but aren’t happy with them. Partly because the apps generally aren’t good, and partly because you end up with a lot of wasted “your desired relationship structure isn’t what I want” matches.
OkCupid has some support for it, but that app hasn’t been good or interesting in years. Tinder lets you pick your relationship type, but you can’t like filter by it. Soneone threatened to “report me” on Hinge (I think?) for wanting a non monogamous relationship. Maybe they thought relationship anarchy was something dangerous.
This might be different outside of NYC, where I am.
This might be different outside of NYC, where I am.
Dating outside of a major city is incredibly hard, and being non-mono makes it even harder.
At older age ranges the ENM users are definitely more noticeable on the dating apps.
Not just dating, I think gen x looks at everything that way at this point.
This 👆
They absolutely were and It’s a little gross how much they just look from afar and go " Yeah, but our parents never loved us really."
Dude same and you aren’t doing much better, and I will never own a house so fuck off.
As s genx I totally agree, seeing the problems so clearly then just saying ‘I can’t believe the boomers let this hsppen’ while doing nothing about any of it is infuriating.
I think this is as much about early millenials as about late Gen X. Early Gen X are just worried they’ll never get grandchildren at this point.
Oh God yes.
Look me and my wife met on a dating site. No shame in this. We both had pretty detailed profiles with lots of photos and luckily for us we were living fairly close by in the same stages in life. Our first date we both kinda knew what we were about. At the same time neither of us had real social media accounts so yeah no weird stalking games.
Now, me and her dated for three years until we moved in together. That was enough time. Time to see each other as people, warts and all. We have our share of embarrassing memories. I remember the time she got wasted and threw up BBQ squid and wine on me on the train. She remembers the time my card got declined at dinner. We had seen each other frustrated, failing at something, ill, broke, in the morning, drunk, out of work, and all the other downs real humans have. Both of us decided we were okay with that and well we are still together today.
Now I see the black mirror like horrorshow that is tinder from my younger friends and hear them say things how they consider it sus if you aren’t on Instagram. I see them acting like a date is a job interview. Gameification and weird cryptic terms like “high value”. Long lists of must haves and must nots.
Mother of fuck how and why would anyone want this? I felt like we had it pretty well figured out when in my early 20s. You could meet someone the traditional way or you could use a dating site and find someone who has the same fun hobbies as you. Oh they aren’t exactly who you normally date? Ok. See what happens.
Gameification and weird cryptic terms like “high value”.
Oh man have you seen that ad that is all about how it’s a dating site only for “high value” people called like Elite Singles or some bullshit.
Literally they make it seem everyone is literally some Sherlock type when most people that think they are, are much more likely Lastrade except hyping crypto more.
I think everyone is just looking for a way to pretend harder that nothing is wrong and if they grind their face against the wheel a little harder they will be finally able to be good enough off to not think about it all. It seems miserable.
“High value” is also a term used in the FemaleDatingStrategy community, which is a community of women who advocate for traditional chivalry, abstinence until commitment, and strongly opposes BDSM under the belief that it’s essentially abuse.
I’m not sure if that has any bearing on the emptymology of the common usage of the term.
FemaleDatingStrategy community,
I think I will tell my wife right now how much I love her.
They’re flipping the Pickup Artist concepts on men, so that particular concept long predates app based dating and the FDS community. “High Value” is definitely a specific phrase used in discussing attracting women over 20 years ago.
Good to know!
Haven’t seen it. I do remember when I heard about Raya wanting to bury the human race in a pit of acid however.
We both had pretty detailed profiles with lots of photos
Same with my wife and I who met online a couple of years back. Even back then, lots of other men would complain about having a hard time getting matches, being poorly treated on dates, etc. which did happen to me, but just as often I’d make a promising connection.
I think part of the reason I was relatively successful despite not being terribly attractive is I treated online dating a bit like online shopping, whereas I think others treat it like a virtual version of bumping in to someone at a bar.
To give you an example of a profile I might skip:
My idea of a great first date: Just about anything!
Likes: food, traveling, and probably your dog
Dealbreakers: pineapple on pizzaFirst prompt tells me nothing about you besides you’re easy going. That’s a great opportunity to share something you like doing, squandered.
Second prompt is the same likes that everybody writes in their profile, and doesn’t lead to naturally staring a unique conversation. Everybody likes “travel and food” so, “Where have you travelled,” and, “What’s your favourite food,” are well-trodden and tired topics IMO. Either share something specific about food or travel, or mention something else entirely.
Third prompt takes another opportunity to save us both some time by stating an actual deal breaker, squandered into a cliche joke.
A better version of that profile could be (just winging it off the top of my head):
My idea of a great first date: I love to ride my bike! Let’s ride some trails and then get a dessert. I know the best spot in town for croissants!
Likes: blunt communication and lots of personal space to get to know someone
Dealbreakers: if you still live with your parentsFirst prompt tells me that you like biking which could be a conversation breaker about which trails you like, what type of bike you ride, and we could also talk about that croissant place, or our other favourite desserts.
Second prompt is useful as someone approaching dating you, and could be a deal breaker for potential suitors.
Third prompt states a real deal breaker which could save us both time, and it’s not something (religion, political affiliation, hair colour) which is usually covered in the profile and filterable in your preferences, or in photos.
In my opinion, there were a lot more of the former type of profiles, but I found it easier to break the ice and connect with the latter type of profile. The former profile is fine if you’re both just looking for a hook up and the prompts are secondary to the eye candy, but if you’re looking for a long lasting connection, it’s all about the prompts.
My question to those who are dating just a couple of years later: how have things changed?
whereas I think others treat it like a virtual version of bumping in to someone at a bar.
Little to do with your point, but I think it’s worth mentioning here.
I read this whole thing about how it’s absolutely nothing like bumping into someone in a bar which is part of why it’s so bad.
The jist of it is that in a bar, your options are limited. So even if someone doesn’t visually meet your ideal, you often get over the hump quickly and get to know them as a person which might all of a sudden make them attractive to you.
On an app, if they don’t meet your visual ideal, the next candidate is just a figurative swipe left and so there is zero chance to get over that hump.
Plus, in an app, you don’t see the group of people surrounding the most attractive options, whether they are trying to filter through them or have fun with each one they like.
Also, you can lower your tolerance of the less fun stuff because it feels like there’s always more options available. Like someone but they aren’t available on a free day you have? Someone else might be available on that day, so just pivot to them. Or try both at once, or keep the other on the backburner, only to discover they could read the sudden adjusted level of interest and aren’t as keen themselves anymore.
It happened once to me in RL. I met one girl at a bar one night, hit it off with her well. Then, that same week, she wasn’t able to come to another bar I was going to and I started out wingmanning for a friend by talking to the friend of someone he was interested in so he could talk to her and ended up going home with that friend. I couldn’t handle having two girls being interested and ended up screwing it up with both. But that’s what it almost always feels like with online dating, and I bet it’s even worse for women who get way more matches.
And on top of that, I know that Tinder makes more money if someone wants to find a partner but fails to. I know they have incentive to hire people (or bots) to match, chat for a bit, then flake out. Or independent scammers looking to chat and take money. I have a paid sub and had what seemed like a great match right as renewal was coming up, then she flaked before a date could happen. Who knows if she was real or not, she could have been but at this point it’s hard to get excited about meeting anyone, which makes it harder to engage genuinely, and I hardly feel anything even when I do match with someone that I think I’d really like.
I’m glad I’m generally content being single or this would be pretty depressing.
Also dating apps are a complete privacy nightmare
And a waste of money
I paid $0 for the app I met my wife on.
Same.
It was MySpace.
Which app, and how long ago was it?
OkCupid for me and we’ve been together over 10 years now.
Yeah same meme then. OKC and every other dating site have gone so far down hill they’re underwater at this point.
I was on OKC 10 years ago and I really liked it. I’m OKC now and my fucking god is it useless… It’s tinder 2.0 along with every other dating site Match Group bought… Oh and it’s like $50+ a month if you’re crazy enough to pay.
I’m sure I’ll still be on there in another 10 years when it’s just swiping from live stream to live stream…
Yikes! I make sure to buy my wife flowers ASAP. I don’t want to end up dating again.
Things have gotten a hell of a lot worse since then
Tinder 2020 for me, we get married in August.
Tinder 2016, the glory days. From what I hear, that shit is a cesspool now
I paid a little bit and met my wife on one. No idea why anyone has a problem with paying for something they use. Two children later, I would say a lifetime the woman of my dreams made the few months that I paid for the tinder subscription was worth it. There were useful features then that came with it. No idea about it now.
You misspelled time.
For those of us still in Nam, kill me, please.
Please kill me too, right after this guy 😭
Please kill me three, but before these two I’m impatient!
:P
Kill me fourth, but before these first three
Im trying to solve this like some sort of logic puzzle
Arent you the guy everyone says to touch
Dibs on thirdsies
Now kith
I am sorry. If it makes you feel any better I only had one healthy long term relationship in my life, I dated plenty before I met my wife but yeah best not speak of it. So given my track record of like 20-1 if I became single again I am just going to call it.
This, definitely.
We got to live our teens and twenties without smartphones and social media - and it was so awesome.
You did something incredibly embarassing last weekend when you were drunk? No need to worry about photos or videos online and nobody would remember or care a few weeks later.
You date someone a few times and things don’t match up? You move on, no need to worry about them stalking or badmouthing you online.
The world seemed to be on a course for the better and the dumbass populist movements were marginal in most countries. Future looked bright and it was easy to be carefree. We got to enjoy our youths.
There were no short or vertical videos. You had to read vast majority of the information available, which made you actually process the info. And someone had put in the effort to write the stuff coherently, because no-one would read the kind of crap that video bloggers are spewing out of their mouths.
By the time we started working, the economic situation was mostly stable and getting a loan for a house or an apartment was pretty much guaranteed.
And so much more. I count myself extremely lucky to have been born in the late 70’s.
I have some good friends who were born in the 70s, and some born in the early 80s. I’m essentially the cusp. My friends who are only three or four years older went through high school never hiding a phone in a hoodie pocket to text their girlfriend. I got my first cell phone my junior year of high school. Facebook came out essentially contemporaneous with my acceptance to college. Social media then and cell phones then are absolutely not the same as the shit we have now. It was a freedom to communicate, and privacy was your choice. Now, privacy is up to whichever service you use, and most likely it doesn’t exist. And it’s odd because kids today seem to be okay with it.
Myspace and flip phones were fantastic. There were drawbacks, sure, but overall they allowed people to spread their wings and find like-minded individuals. Now, it seems like it’s a funnel to nowhere.
You can still get flip phones. Caterpillar makes one that looks decent and AFAIK does 5g
Yeah, that ship has sailed, unfortunately. Pandora’s box has opened and my phone and my income stream are pretty intertwined at this point. It’s also how I Lemmy.
https://www.catphones.com/en-us/cat-s22-flip/
It’s Android!
80s babies got most of that too except we were the leading edge of the housing and college jobs crisis. Graduated right into the dot com recession and then 2008 wiped the floor with a lot of us.
But I don’t think the embarrassing history thing is as bad as you think it is. I think it’s just become a red flag to judge your date based on things that were a while ago. The real terror is being stalked. It is way too easy to get stalked these days.
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I’m sorry that happened.
I am in my early 40s. Stalking and badmouthing was defintly a problem before social media as well.
I am male and still have that experience. Was much worse for women/girls.
Everybody says this. I heard this from older people about dating 10 years ago, and 20 years ago. This is just what people say as they get older regardless of how dating changes.
Yeah, see if I had to start dating again, I wouldn’t date Gen Z. Problem solved.
I dunno. There is statistics that show younger people to have less and less sex. And it certainly is not because of more prudeness nowadays. While not the final indicator i do think it to be representative of the general lack of stable relationships.
Younger people not having homes to rent might be a large contributor.
Taking someone home to your room in your parents house has never been a “player move”.
You make a great point. Also dating typically involves going out and that is expensive. I also think people are more honest today. They feel more comfortable not having to lie about it to seem cool. I think past data are skeptically full of some lies padding the data given the peer pressures of older generations behaviors.
Gotta say I’m glad we can be and date any genders we like these days with much milder pushback (on average) than used to be the case. Really does help zoomers be a lot healthier imo, even if we’ve got other issues in the internet age.
But… pushback is the whole reason you go on a date…
Hmm… usually I prefer push-in 😇
Sounds like somebody’s jelly when they should be more like jello
Yep, dating sucks no matter what era you’re in.
*slowly puts away his picnic basket and bicycle made for two
daisy… daisy…
Yeeeah, I found myself single again after a divorce, and I have not even tried to date seriously after seeing what’s currently on the market.
Folks out here thinking that dating is a replacement for some much-needed therapy.
If you only have first dates you never need to move past identifying your problems. No work needed to push through them. Check Mate psychos!
No need for self-improvement if you decide that issue lies with everyone else! ♡
I met my wife in 2011, just before Tinder got big in our area. I remember our single friends being ecstatic when Tinder was first around, saying about how easy it was to meet people.
Many of them are still single and now well into their 30’s. They talk a lot about wanting to find someone special, but they just swipe and swipe and swipe all day to no avail. Shit’s bleak out there. And I just know that if I didn’t meet my wife I’d probably be stuck in the same rut.
I’m on “the apps” as a nearly 40 year old. It is a nightmare for sure. With so many options little things or “not vibing” on the very first in-person interaction ends any chance at forming a relationship.
While this negative thinking about dating can def lead down or around the incel community, there are def many negative aspects of online dating becoming the norm that are def not ideal.
The online dating community seems so messed up. Doesn’t it make sense to move away from that and seek out the people who aren’t embedded in that app culture? The ones who are going to meetups and classes and activities to meet people in person the old fashioned way.
Def not a bad way to do it. One meetup group I am in is mostly run by a power couple who met in the group years ago.
Preach. I’m a 45 year old living it now. It’s odd.
I watch single millennial friends dating at it looks fucking miserable.
Very lucky to be hitched
I have a friend who is recently divorced.
Don’t get me wrong, they’re both better off, but it’s bleak out there for singles.
It’s an age thing.
People with desirable traits for pairing up do so more frequently than those who lack these traits. As individuals pair up, the average quality of the remaining unpaired pool declines.
So the dating pool for early 20 year olds might be 1 dud: 20 mediocre: 1 winner. By the time people hit 40 the dating pool is 500 duds: 5 mediocre: 1 winner.
I dont think this is accurately describing people and how they develop. You have many people that are fine partners but got stuck in toxic relationships. You have people that were great “matches” in their twenties but turned to become terribly self absorbed arseholes in their thirties and vice versa you have people who developed to become very decent. You have people that were fine but wanted to sleep aroung in their 20s and then became monogamous and people who did the opposite.
Also you entirely ignore that as more people are permanently in relationships with increasing age that also means the “competition” reduces.
Finally this assume the observer to be somewhat static in their relation to other people being duds, mediocre or winner. But given your numbers they would become more likely to be duds or mediocre as they get single at higher age. Two “mediocre” can make a fine couple. And quite frankly, if the only people someone ever get to know are “duds” chance is he or she needs to work through some issues.
Of course it doesn’t match the data. It is the just world fallacy. Failure occurs because a person is a failure and you know that because our world only allows just results. Success occurs because a person has merit and you know that because our world only allows just results.
Could be a million reasons why a person is single in their 30s? Nah only one.
How about you try reading what I wrote again. Apparently my simple analysis was too complex for you to understand.
A few basics for the logically and statistically impaired. This is a simple analysis of the probability of pairing up.
Having desirable traits for pairing up: I didn’t mentioned what these were to for a very good reason. It doesn’t matter to the analysis. What matters is the resulting rate of pairing up. Those that have traits desirable to pairing up are removed from the dating pool more quickly than those that don’t.
This creates a constant strong selection pressure of removal on the pool.
I also used to terms to describe the potential relationship not the people. Because who or what these people are is immaterial.
Dud = no chance of pairing up.
Mediocre = moderate chance of paring up.
Winner = pairing up.
Seriously…
Yeah so this type of narratives is why I am very very glad I am happily married. I don’t rank humans, I don’t think of humans in terms of what they can do for me only. I am also aware that a disturbing high degree of what we are is what situation we are in.
I make six-figures and I have been homeless. Generally your brain works worse as you get older so homeless me was smarter than uppermiddle class me. I know he was in a lot better shape physically and had a full set of hair.
I can make you a shitty person by giving you a foot injury. I can make you a loving person with women weed. And you know what? We are all shitty judges of character.
I was divorced at 36 and found a girlfriend 6 months later. It’s really not that bad out there. Just make sure you’re taking care of yourself and it makes it a lot easier.
Dating apps are terrible because they don’t want you to actually find a good partner. If you find a good partner, you have no need for the dating app anymore. So they’ll match you with people that’ll peak your interest, but ultimately won’t work out.
Obviously there’s more to it than just that, but this is a big part of the problem.
Almost everything is owned by the same company, match.com. So all the apps are built to extract as much cash as possible out of whatever demographic they’re designed for. AFAIK the only one that isn’t owned by them is bumble, because the woman who started bumble helped found tinder and was sexually harassed by one of her male co-founders. Imagine that.
I don’t remember where this figure came from, so take it with a grain of salt, but I believe that something like 75% of all dating app accounts are dudes.
My afvice is to find a hobby that can be social and meet someone that likes doing what you do. I hear all the hotties are protesting inequality now…
I met my wife on one of the apps. For the life of me at this point I don’t remember which one.
I had all but given up on the entire idea of online dating and was ready to delete my profiles. I had spent years, and embarrassingly some actual dollars on these apps, sent probably thousands of messages over the years and had a handful of first dates and little else to show for it.
I was the first person my wife connected with. Not that she hadn’t dated before, just had never used an app to do it.
What a lucky coincidence. :3 Maybe not immediately, in your case, but I’m glad you found each other!
I had more luck meeting people on a penpal app than getting a single match on any of the major dating apps. The algorithm just always seems to sort me out. It can really mess with your self esteem when you’re never getting a single match or reply to your messages.
It’s definitely not me, because I get hundreds of letters on Slowly, where it’s actually about communication and I’m even going on a vacation with a girl I met there next week.
Tinder & Co. are useless, objectifying apps that build on greed and should be burned to the ground.
That sounds nice. What’s the name of the pen pal app?
Slowly!
What’s. The. Name. Of. The. Pen. Pal. App.
I’ll see myself out.(Also many thanks ☺️)
My wife and I have been together for a decade. Before she and I met, I dated pretty heavily on the online options at the time. All of my worst dates ever were found online. I decided online dating was depressing and stupid, just stopped trying to date anyone, and started just meeting people in person. It was wildly more successful. I had fewer dates but they were way higher quality. No one showing up on shrooms, ghosting me, or acting scandalized because I’m a little guy despite it being outlined multiple times in my online profile.
Aside: The latter is my personal favorite. I’m a hair over 5’6 and proportionally built. I’m not just short, I’m small. One woman I met immediately accused me of being deceptive about my height, even though I was actually taller than claimed at around 5’7 with dress shoes on. She was also 5’6 but was standing a bit taller than me. She had forgotten she was wearing heels. That date ended quickly. Bullet dodged.
My sister is 5’3" and she had a thing for tall guys. After a string of bad dates, she decided to give someone a shot who was 5’2". Six years later they got married.
Nothing but respect for the short king with mad moves. My brother-in-law is cool as hell and I’m glad he’s the guy my sister landed on.
Height is such a bad thing to filter based on.
My wife’s best friend was complaining about how she goes on lots of dates but there’s never a real connection. She is a little taller than average but insisted she needed a guy at least 6’2" (so he would be at least X" taller than her when she was wearing X" heels).
That’s just a terrible priority if you want a real connection.
Because you want to have to tilt your head up at least 20° (?) to kiss while wearing high heels, you’re willing to eliminate 95% of bachelors? Have you considered the logistics of kissing while you’re not wearing high heels?
But the criterion was like a point of pride for her, like her ego wouldn’t allow her to look for someone less than 6’2". Super weird. Just not a good way to find a partner.
My husband and I are the same height. Never understood the whole tall dude preference/requirement but people are into different things I guess. A nice side perk is I can borrow his shirts and not be swimming in them. They’re still baggy and comfortable from the different cut, but not so big the sleeves cover my hands.
I’m getting close to 40 and feel like I got left behind. It’s rare that I even meet someone I would want to date let alone them want to date me as well. I don’t have any interest in dating apps because they require too much information and putting pictures online so unless I happen to meet someone in real life I’ve just gotten comfortable being single.
It can work out. I met my wife on a dating site when I was 38. Happily married over 15 years now.
You do have to be careful though; you can meet all sorts of weirdos on the internet. She’d agree with that.
That’s great but I’m not putting pictures or details about myself online. That’s a hard no.
At least I know there are other people who will know what it’s like when I get to that stage
I met my SO in… I think it was 2017? Well after the rise of Tinder. We did not meet on Tinder, and neither of us have ever had an account on there.
We met through a social group for a game (not dissimilar to pokemon go), where we happened to play for the same team in the same area. We would have team meet ups occasionally and all go for coffee and to play the game at locations where there was a lot of things to do in the game.
I have not, and likely will never, use something like Tinder. Not only is it unlikely that my current relationship would fail, but even if I found myself single for some reason, I just couldn’t care less. I’ve been through it all already. A LOT of shit relationships to the point where I’m kind of over it. If I didn’t have my current relationship, I’m not sure I’d care to get into another one. To put it simply, my partner and I are so well matched that we’ve never felt the need to even raise our voice at eachother. I have an amazing relationship, we’re both happy and comfortable. The only thing left to do is put a ring on it and wait for our inevitable demise. I wouldn’t try to find any cheap substitute for them. Nobody has a chance of measuring up. I don’t think that would be fair to anyone involved.
I have no illusions. I was profoundly lucky. So I don’t expect anyone to “get” it.
I am with them, and they are with me, now, until the end of our days. Separate, and together.
Was it ingress? If so you bastards better not be team blue.
This guy’s with The Enlightened, rattle him boys!
Blue sucks.
Frog or foe?
Ribbit.
