Nor that the information that they use against you be necessarily true given their accepted monopoly in ‘truth’.

The Bible and it’s mostly commendable teachings are an uncritically examined votive for a cargo cult that is being weaponised against America’s democracy. What the ten commandments are, or are not, is immaterial. The critical lesson is the hegemony of Christians over non-Christians and, most importantly, distilled to the naturalness/righteousness of hegemony/hierarchy.

It is a thin entering wedge that is intended to open up the possibility of inculcating children with divisive conceptions and undermining critical thinking.

Yes the ten commandments could be put up on the wall with egalitarian intentions but that is implicitly not the case with the MAGA movement.

I wasn’t trying to be argumentative just adding clarity. I hope.

Think of it more like the flu. If I caught the flu I might have a temperature, a sore throat, loss of appetite, and headaches. If you catch the flu you might get headaches, diarrhea, exhaustion, and a dry cough.

Fascism is built upon and characterised by the exploitation of the current fissures of a stressed society. It is unlikely to lead to gas chambers and Hugo Boss uniforms as they were part of the specific evolution of fascism in Germany after it was crippled by the loss of the first world war. Usually, there are all sorts of barriers to full blooded fascism that give it part of its local character too as it tries to morph into whatever conglomerate of memes that it can ride to power.

Right now in America the pressure for fascism is being built with the tacit support of a lot of evangelical christians. It is not the whole of the story. It is part of the conglomerate. So the pride flags come down and the ten commandments go up.

The impulse behind one act is inclusive, welcoming persecuted minorities. This is fundamentally egalitarian and strengthens society.

The other is intended as part of a drive for cultural hegemony where a specific ingroup is underlined as sovereign. A hierarchial society of a majority of innate winners and, importantly, subgoups of losers/outsiders (to be feared/hated) is the backbone of fascism.

Of course, a single piece of straw will not break society’s back and manifest fascism on its own but pressure towards it is created by an aggregation of such straw.

You beauty! I missed the update.

Do you not have otters?

Money is power. Just because that shower have the sense to sit outside of the spotlight of political scrutiny does not mean that they are apolitical nor does it make the influence they cast not strongly American in flavour.

And America too.

Hey hey hey!

Don’t be dragging granola into this fuckwit-ocracy. It’s a perfectly reasonable low effort breakfast for those of us that are unable to cook for ourselves because we can’t find our arses with both hands for the first hour of semi-consciousness in the morning.

To acquire one unpaired valence electron.

I don’t call for an end to America over its hundreds of years of killings, murder, rape, slavery, genocide, ecocide, innumerable hypocrisies, and corrupting hegemony. I don’t come on here and sweatily proclaim that all I hope for is the fall of the American ascendency. I don’t because I recognise that America like Catholics or Muslims is a vast mix of people with a wide range of lived experiences and view points. And that not all of their history is terrible. Some of it is actually commendable. And the actions of the leaders often do not line up with the majority of their people.

Yes, true, Catholic church is outdated and reactionary with way more than it’s fair share bad actors but there are also hundreds of millions of Catholics, and people with Catholic backgrounds but no longer practicing, out there that are a wide mix of human beings that deserve a basic amount of respect.

You can, for clarity, include within the parameters of basic respect, to not have to endure your overgeneralising hostile invective.

I’m sorry but you come off as just another nutty reactionary to me.

Have a good day.

It’s perfectly legitimate to have issues with any organised religion but damning everyone brought up in their traditions is myopic.

I was brought up a catholic in Northern Ireland during the troubles. Similar prejudice was routinely trotted out to justify treating us as second class citizens. So surprise, surprise even now as an atheist, I find it a bit triggering, as anyone mght imagine, to hear someone singling out my persecuted community in such a toxic mischaracterisation. I didn’t ask to be catholic but I was brought up in a community of caring and open minded people. Sure there were arseholes but guess what every community has them.

There are some Catholics that are reactionary morons but the majority are not. Describing religions by the worst people in them doesn’t really come across as tolerant. Which ironically is what you’re accusing them of.

My genX ass was trying skibidi on its own cause most of the rest of the text is usually auto-suggested while typing in the search terms.

Literal Roman DVD goddess.

And I appreciate your civil attempts at clarifying your stance too. To the degree that I think we’re both talking past each other.

On my part, even as an outsider to US politics, I have been getting more and more frustrated with a lot of the bullying rhetoric I see on this platform directed towards potential voters that are very concerned about the US’s current complicity in the ongoing genocide. I see them getting talked down to with utter contempt. Being berated by people who insouciantly weigh a potential loss of comforts at home against the real and current killing of tens of thousands of innocent civilians and the forced famine of hundreds of thousands.

Now is the only time that they can apply pressure on Biden. Now that he actually needs something from them. But (like MLK’s white moderates) people here are telling them that “now is not the time” and a whole spectrum of worse accusations too. But if the civil rights movement hadn’t agitated and pressed for change decades would have passed before the moderates would have opened their eyes and acted beyond the pale.

Personally, I agree ostensibly with your calculus (though not with your particular framing of it but it is still a very, very tight call) but if I was a US voter I would be vocally holding my vote hostage until the last moment to make sure that my discontent was given the greatest chance of not being ignored.

More importantly (and central to this whole discussion) i still believe that people have a right to respectful discourse if they can’t morally make it over the sizable hurdles.

Which brings me round back to you. You’ve been very patient and civil throughout this discourse even though we have different perspectives. So my ‘beef’ ain’t wit you my friend. Though I do wonder what is your line in the ground that if both of the two main candidates were guilty of something that you’d drop the lesser of two evils calculus and vote for a third party. For me both are terrible choices but the potential for long term democratic, human rights, and environmental protection regression under Trump cannot be underestimated

It is ‘rational’ attitudes such as this that MLK bemoaned in his Birmingham jail letters. Order above justice. An order in which the boot is not on your neck. So you minimize its dehumanizing brutality in relation to the maintenance of the day-to-day comforts you enjoy.

Hypothetically: if Biden was sending weapons and financial support to Russia in support of their war efforts but mildly denouncing Putin when pressed; and Trump was pledging full throated support of Putin and offering to nuke Kyiv; would you still feel so enthusiastic about voting for Biden or for your moral calculus? Might you lament the electoral system that has put this decision before you. Might you protest this mockery of democratic choice. Even if you internally still cede to moral calculus, might you continue to make your displeasure known and apply whatever pressure was within your purview as a voter to make. Might you be offended by people demanding you not only vote for Biden regardless your rightful concerns about Putin and the sovereignity of Ukrainians but also try to insinuate that you are part of some foreign operation to undermine the election for voicing your concerns?