• Swarfega@lemm.ee
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    10 months ago

    I’m predominantly a Windows user. However I dual boot with Mint as I am trying to get away from Windows. It’s really not easy but I’m trying.

    I gotta say though these types of posts make me cringe. I really don’t know why some Linux users put themselves on a pedestal all the time. You make these sorts of smug posts making out that Linux is perfect. I have never installed Linux and had it just work. There is always something that requires searching the web for a fix and firing up the terminal to start changing something in /etc/.

    I get it. You’re proud of your technology. But vegans are proud they don’t eat animal products. We don’t need to keep selling it to the rest of the world.

    • SpaceScotsman@startrek.website
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      10 months ago

      I’ve found it easier to use KDE to switch from windows as it feels like a more complete ecosystem that I’m familiar with. And it is pretty great, until I install one bad graphics driver and then I’m stuck in a terminal only session until I can fix it. At least windows has safe mode.

      • Polar@lemmy.ca
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        10 months ago

        Meanwhile KDE/Fedora gave me the most issues on both my laptop and desktop.

        The UI drops to 1hz refresh rate for some reason.

        My mouse cursor theme was causing issues with Firefox. My mouse would just disappear when using Firefox.

        Konsole and Dolphin kept opening in a tiny window, where I had to expand it every time to see the text. No amount of saving preferences would fix it.

        The logout button hard locked my PC. Only way to fix it was to reboot my PC with the power button.

        Steam constantly locked up, even when trying to play games rated GOLD on Protondb.

        Davinci resolve refused to launch. Kept giving me errors.

        I then gave up. Most of the issues never got fixed, and the ones that I did manage to fix took HOURS of Googling. These are all such basic features/tasks that literally work out of the box on Windows/Mac.

    • LemoineFairclough@sh.itjust.worksOP
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      10 months ago

      What problems do you have most often? Can you come up with a description of a class of problems you have that would account for most of the time you spend troubleshooting?

      Who provided the documentation you used to install a Linux operating system you had trouble with? I don’t recall having serious issues after installing openSUSE or Fedora Linux or even NixOS, and I certainly don’t recall having any issues of above-average importance that weren’t a direct result of my intentional actions (e.g. trying to permanently change what DNS servers would be used).

  • atyaz@reddthat.com
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    10 months ago

    I think it’s humorous how many people are getting offended at such a silly post

    • Queue@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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      10 months ago

      So many people here are butthurt because of a small meme that pokes fun at what 90% of end users experience.

      Its not Linux’s fault they can’t take a joke about windows. And yet somehow we are the elitist snowflake gatekeepers, or whatever buzzword they wanna use today.

  • nyakojiru@lemmy.dbzer0.com
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    10 months ago

    The last character: I can make you spend an entire day trying to install some software or configuring something specific

      • Abnorc@lemm.ee
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        10 months ago

        Maybe I’m unique in this regard, but I can’t remember having any issues installing things on windows since Windows 7. Trying out Linux in college was fun and interesting, but I definitely spent more time futzing around with it to make it work the way that I want it to work.

        I think more people would take the Linux community here seriously if people just acknowledged the flaws with Linux based OSes and focused on the actual benefits of Linux over windows. (Which are getting more and more enticing as Microsoft makes windows more annoying.)

        • Black616Angel@feddit.de
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          10 months ago

          I know what you mean and Linux can be the operating system with less issues as well. E.g. I never had printer issues with my system but have to troubleshoot others’ printers regularly.

          If you only use Linux for browsing and light office work you probably never encounter problems. Even if you play games via steam and Proton there probably will never be something.

          The same is true for Windows. If you only use it for a small subset of tasks (browsing, light office work or playing recent games) you will rarely encounter problems.

          But if you try to do so without a Microsoft account or if you don’t want a bloated start menu, it starts to get tricky.

          And don’t get me started on playing old games or getting some programming dependencies running. This can be hell.

          I know the flaws of windows (I’ve used it up until last year and still have to use it at work) and I also know the limitations of Linux. They are both not perfect, but Linux is free and Windows becomes more and more shit (as you’ve said). And this is where I don’t understand all the people saying, that windows is easier. It really isn’t anymore. It was a few years ago though.

          • TopRamenBinLaden@sh.itjust.works
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            10 months ago

            I imagine that most people think Windows is easier because the majority of people grew up using Windows machines in schools, workplaces, etc. I think it could have to do with the sense of familiarity there.

            The other problem I think people have with Linux is that the fact that different distros confuses them. Most average people are afraid of the command line, and really want a GUI for everything. Many of these people’s first exposure to Linux could scare them away depending on the distro they happened to choose, I think.

            • Polar@lemmy.ca
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              10 months ago

              Most average people are afraid of the command line, and really want a GUI for everything. Many of these people’s first exposure to Linux could scare them away depending on the distro they happened to choose, I think.

              Or it’s the fact the community is so toxic?

              Every computer, doesn’t matter brand or hardware, never works 100% out of the box on Linux. Doesn’t matter which distro.

              You ask online, and people scream at you to run terminal commands or go back to Windows.

              You run a terminal command that breaks your system, and people blame you for running random terminal commands…

              You go back to Windows, and people say “Linux is so friendly, you don’t even have to touch the terminal anymore if you really don’t want to!”

              Rinse and repeat.

      • Polar@lemmy.ca
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        10 months ago

        99.9% of Windows software runs after you run the .exe

        Which programs require so much troubleshooting for you?

        • dave@hal9000@lemmy.world
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          10 months ago

          I just spent 30+ minutes troubleshooting an MS office installer today that would just shut off after the splash screen, on a friend’s brand new laptop… But then again, I spent two hours trying to get my old Brother network scanner/printer on Manjaro a few weeks ago.

  • SickPanda@lemmy.world
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    10 months ago

    Linux users are like Vegans. No one likes them and they won’t stop bratting about being a Linux user.

    • Dizzy Devil Ducky@lemm.ee
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      10 months ago

      I’m slowly going down the open source rabbit hole, but I have yet to fully go down the part where you preach about it like it’s a God. I hope I never get that far, as I also use Linux from time to time as well. I ain’t looking to be one of those annoying users who constantly brings it up if I can help it.

      • Polar@lemmy.ca
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        10 months ago

        Talking about Linux is fine. Coming into any tech/tech support post, screaming that Linux is the answer, even if the person explains why they need Windows/Mac, is not.

        It’s like the Christians that comment on a dying persons tiktok about how God knows best, and God will heal them lmao. Literally not helpful and extremely ignorant and rude.

        • LemoineFairclough@sh.itjust.worksOP
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          10 months ago

          The thing is that Unix will solve every problem, the only question is when. Year of the Linux desktop 2070?

          I’m legitimately unsure if it’s appropriate to be running mission-critical systems on the Microsoft Windows platform nowadays, but transitioning will obviously take some time.

  • Hazdaz@lemmy.world
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    10 months ago

    On the plus side, even if you did need to update Linux, it’s not like you are running anything on it anyways.

    • Polar@lemmy.ca
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      10 months ago

      I saw a post on Lemmy super recently how Tux Racer is literally better than any other game ever made, and how that’s the power of FOSS gaming. It was not satire.

  • phillaholic@lemm.ee
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    10 months ago

    Just installed Ubuntu today for the first time in at least a decade. Touchpad two-finger scrolling is so sensitive. There’s no setting for it. I have to replace the driver with the synapse one, if my laptop supports it.

  • EmperorHenry@discuss.tchncs.de
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    10 months ago

    I can control my updates on windows with the group policy editor.

    Delay “feature” updates by 365 days, delay “quality” updates by 30 days. then the only updates that get installed right away are the security updates, the other two categories will get pulled if a large number of people report problems with them.

    Windows is annoying…unless you know what tools to get to make it work correctly.

    I’m a big fan of Linux, don’t get me wrong QubesOS is the best thing I’ve ever heard of. But almost nothing I use is compatible with any distro of linux.

    Once you use things like O&O shutup 10 and a few other things in the group policy editor, you’ll love your windows machine.

      • EmperorHenry@discuss.tchncs.de
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        10 months ago

        I’m not so sure if that had any subtext in it or not. It’s hard to detect sarcasm over a medium like this.

        Being autistic doesn’t help detect sarcasm either.

        • radix@lemm.ee
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          10 months ago

          Sorry, it wasn’t supposed to be sarcastic. As I read it I thought it was ambiguous too, but for some reason I couldn’t think of a way to clarify. Somehow I forgot about the existence of tone indicators.

          I’ve been pretty out of it due to significant physical pain. I’ve been using Lemmy as a way to talk to strangers I treat as friends, as a distraction I don’t think too much about. I’m sorry for any confusion. I send a stranger’s well wishes.

          I’m genuinely happy for you that Windows works. It didn’t for me, but that’s alright. And sometimes an OS is just a tool, not an identity.

  • eee@lemm.ee
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    10 months ago

    Linux: “my users spend half their time troubleshooting”

    • Fixbeat@lemmy.ml
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      10 months ago

      I am a Windows guy, but I occasionally have to work with Linux. I spend a lot of time googling weird problems with cryptic solutions. That’s my experience trying to do anything technical with Linux. I can’t really remember the last time I had a problem in windows, but that’s not to say windows is perfect. It’s taken a hit in usability recently, which is weird since they’ve had decades to refine things. I recently installed pop os as a dual boot and it’s been pretty great with the ability to play games. I haven’t really had to do anything technical and I find myself using it more than I thought.

      • torpak@discuss.tchncs.de
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        10 months ago

        At least most problems under Linux have solutions and if you are really desperate you have the option to fix it yourself in the source or pay someone to do it. Under windows, if microsoft doesn’t care about your problem, you either find a workaround or live with it.

        • Honytawk@lemmy.zip
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          10 months ago

          Because of the ginormous community, every problem has a solution in Windows.

          If it isn’t a Microsoft sanctioned solution, then multiple third party solutions exists that fix it.

          Windows has a hell of a lot more support than any Linux distribution does.

          • Nefyedardu@kbin.social
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            10 months ago

            If it isn’t a Microsoft sanctioned solution, then multiple third party solutions exists that fix it.

            That’s not how this works. If it’s not a Microsoft-sancioned solution, it literally cannot be fixed no matter how much effort you put in. You need an API to work with Windows. If Microsoft does not provide you with an API, you can’t do it. And even if you find a way to hack together something, you have zero guarantee an update won’t just come along and fuck it. Linux distros are open source, you can change quite literally any thing about them. That is what that person was talking about.

            • halva@discuss.tchncs.de
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              10 months ago

              the thing is, microsoft does provide stable, well-documented and backwards-compatible apis for just about anything imaginable, and even if that’s not enough, you can try interacting with the kernel directly

    • Kusimulkku@lemm.ee
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      10 months ago

      I’ve had hard time troubleshooting on Windows because everything is obfuscated behind so many layers. And there’s just things you can’t feasibly do. But it does seem to work well most of the time.

    • torpak@discuss.tchncs.de
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      10 months ago

      I have to use windows at work. I have to spend a lot more time trouble shooting there than on my bleeding edge rolling release linux at home.

      • Honytawk@lemmy.zip
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        10 months ago

        That is because you perform more work on your work computer instead of browsing lemmy all day.

    • LemoineFairclough@sh.itjust.worksOP
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      10 months ago

      I can’t say I share this experience as I spend a lot more than half my time using Linux watching documentaries on youtube in a web browser. If you are obsessed with personalization I could see this happening, but I happen to prefer using default (as in “possible to consistently re-apply”) settings on most things.

      Regardless, troubleshooting makes you better at resolving trouble that you didn’t bring about on your own, and life is defined by unexpected troubles. It is better to be antifragile than happy!

      • eee@lemm.ee
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        10 months ago

        I guess you’re lucky (or much more tech-savvy than me). I tried to switch to linux once many years ago (pre-COVID, which is like ancient times now). It was horrible. Oh, I now need to learn about file systems and NTFS and ext3/4(?) - i guess i’ll try Linux on a separate, old hard drive. Ok, something didn’t work, I now have to figure out what driver wasn’t supported and what I need to download. Great, people on forums are helpful but they’re asking me a bunch of gibberish. Now I gotta figure out this command line thing. Oh cool some people built GUIs for certain stuff so i don’t need to play with the command line, but then the GUI doesn’t work occasionally and now I have to figure out if it’s the GUI that broke or something else. And then at some point I got stuck because of file permissions.

        • Ooops@kbin.social
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          10 months ago

          Ok, something didn’t work, I now have to figure out what driver wasn’t supported and what I need to download.

          Unlike in Windows where you never need to download drivers. As executable binaries you have no chance of checking. Sometimes from very questionable sources. And actually you can be happy if it’s only a driver. Installing random 3rd party tools just to get basic functionality is a thing.

          people on forums are helpful

          Which also happens for Windows. But rarely. And if they really try… then there are still 10 different answers to a single problem and you have to test which one works for your specific version (no, chosing the most recent one sounds logical but is rarely the answer).

          Now I gotta figure out this command line thing. Oh cool some people built GUIs for certain stuff so i don’t need to play with the command line

          Which in what way is worse then editing random obscure values in the registry? Because it’s a window you type in. And in the worst case even the Windows help starts with poweshell nowadays, which is exactly the same.

          And then at some point I got stuck because of file permissions.

          That’s a solveable problem. Unlike in Windows where they put file permissions on top a file system not having them in a weird unintutive way. And don’t ever try to change the wrong permission as an administrator as that’s simply not allowed. After all you don’t own your Windows PC, MS just gratiously allows you to use it.

          So, you see… it’s all a matter of perspective.

        • Nefyedardu@kbin.social
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          10 months ago

          Trying to use proprietary drivers and NTFS on Linux is trying to fit a square peg in a round hole. People work hard to make it work and maybe it does with a little effort but the proprietary model and Linux distros just don’t mesh well together. If you make it a point to purchase hardware that has open source drivers and use open source software (and as a consumer, you probably should anyway), everything does just work. Obviously this may not suit your use case and Linux may just not be for you.

          • Captain Aggravated@sh.itjust.works
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            10 months ago

            NTFS is okay if you’re mounting a drive that you share with a Windows machine but don’t actually install Linux to an NTFS partition please. Most of the “beginner friendly” distros I don’t think even let you.

        • LemoineFairclough@sh.itjust.worksOP
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          10 months ago

          If I was in your situation, I would try installing openSUSE or Fedora Linux on a computer where you don’t care if the entire disk gets wiped occasionally, using a flash drive you also don’t care about getting wiped occasionally. They probably have sufficiently comprehensive installers and installation instructions for you to succeed in using one of them, and if you don’t care about the content of the disks you use you’ll be more willing to experiment with the installation process (even though it’s unlikely your computer will work worse due to trying to install a Linux distribution). If you use a computer that has become slower and less usable than you’d like you will probably be pleasantly surprised by the results!

          Also, you can back up your product keys and prepare a Microsoft Windows installation disk if being able to go back to Windows 10 makes you more comfortable with experimenting.

          Overall, Linux enhanced my ability to to get productive work done, and also the opportunity to experiment and learn more about how to use computers to solve problems. I think learning how to use a GNU operating system is a good long term investment, though if you still need to keep around at least one computer that runs Microsoft Windows to protect your income I won’t disparage you.

  • HeyMrDeadMan@lemmy.world
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    10 months ago

    I’m really triggered by the idea that Linux makes running old software easy. The bane of my existence is finding an application that depends on libButts.5.1, but my distro ships with libButts.5.3, which isn’t backward compatible for some reason, and trying to install libButts.5.1 bricks the desktop environment for some reason.

    • eumesmo@lemmings.world
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      10 months ago

      I just searched for that lib, in an attempt to help you with the supposed problem. I won’t deny, you got me there.