Image transcript:
Calvin (from Calvin & Hobbes) sitting at a lemonade stand, smiling, with a sign that reads, “Trains and micromobility are inevitably the future of urban transportation, whether society wants it or not. CHANGE MY MIND.”
I like how you assume that society will choose to have a future over self-immolation.
If nothing else, car dependency is fiscally unsustainable. We might go kicking and screaming towards the solution, but eventually people will have no choice but to abandon the financial suicide that is making your city car dependent.
True, and I wish my city would realize it harder, sooner. On the other hand, I just read an article the other day that claims that the collapse of civilization has begun. A lot of societies throughout history perseverated with maladaptive habits after the local environment changed, and thus collapsed. A lot of them didn’t, though, and I hope that we’ll wise up in time.
But yeah, honestly, I’m worried myself that our society is starting to unravel if we don’t get our act together. Unmitigated climate catastrophe may well prove to be the greatest disaster in human history, if you count all the wars, famines, genocide it may cause. I sincerely hope it doesn’t turn out so dire, but so far humanity is stubbornly refusing to do anywhere near enough to stop it. Whether that’s civilization-ending or merely really frickin bad remains to be seen, but it’s also worthwhile noting that collapse doesn’t always mean post-apocalyptic; for farmers in ancient Rome around its collapse, life probably didn’t seem all that different day-to-day.
Yeah that’s a bold assumption. My bet is on “it’s going to get progressively worse and never better”. I have yet to be proven wrong. Since the day I was born everything’s been enshittening with only inconsequential cosmetic improvements (lol technology, what a joke).
My plan is to work from home, be completely self sufficient with minimal transport and do all I can do online.
So your definition of self sufficient is to be 100% reliant on Internet infrastructure?
We shouldn’t take anything for granted. The US has happily killed it’s cities for decades instead of investing in public transit. If we don’t push for it, car companies and rich people will keep public transportation from ever taking off.
If remote work takes off, and ordering most everything online, I wonder if urban sprawl will get even worse.
The more people try to “innovate” transportation the closer it gets to going back to trains. Driverless cars, for efficiency have them communicate with eachother, to accelerate and brake at the same time, for example. That’s just less efficient and more expensive trains.
There’s a massive failure condition for your example - sure, autonomous cars behave like trains when they communicate with each other to sync acceleration and deceleration, but they can also separate themselves from the collective to drive you to the door of your home. In the train metaphor this would be like you sitting in your own train car, and the train car separating from the rest of it and driving you to your doorstep.
oh no, if only someone hadn’t centralized like, a point, say, a station, where people could conveniently access the train of cars…
they could call it a… hmm… TRAIN STATION?
Why cars? Why not buses, trams, trolleys or even bikes?
whoooosh
You reinvented switches.
I think you miss part of transportation system that says system. It’s more than one element.
I especially like that this format of the meme removes the d-bag that is in the original.
I heartily agree, but I’m 67 years old and society is slower than the Antarctic melt. Oh, wait, that’s not slow.
I’m going to make the argument against trains for everything, despite being a huge fanatic for trains.
Trains are the most efficient transport method per tonne-km over land, yes. However from certain operational standpoints trains can make less sense than existing solutions.
When distance between stops for heavy rail becomes too short, you lose quite a bit of efficiency. Trains themselves aren’t a one-size fits all solution as there are various types that each need their own form of investment (which is a lot $), when roads are compatible with both personal transport and large trucks with little investment by the transporter (govt pays for road maintenance).
Rail companies right now are chasing profits and neglecting operational improvements. In the US, hauling a long, LONG, old and slow train loaded with bulk aggregate, oil, grain, chemicals is more profitable than aiming for JIT capability that is more feasible with trucks. A complete change in societal incentives is necessary to bring back the usefulness of railway in all types of transport. Second, the North American way of railroad companies owning the tracks dissuades a lot of innovation and new firms from entering the market, unlike the “open road” where there are many competing OTR freight companies. None of the Big Six would like my idea of a nationally controlled rail/track system.
Electric motors are now capable of >90% regen, so the braking energy argument against short stops doesn’t work anymore (and the energy during motion strictly less than a rubber tired vehicle with a worse aspect ratio so long as the trip is no longer).
The amount of rail needed for short distance distribution networks could still be prohibitive in regions designed for road though. Even then one could still argue that the total infrastructure costs are lower by moving the destinations slightly given how much roads cost to maintain.
Well, streetcars could be an option for high density corridors but they will lose money in low density, low ridership areas.
Roads always lose money, so that’s still a win. Travel speed and coverage may be a limiting factor though.
Roads and cars lose money constantly.
Idk how the train will pick me up living in the middle of nowhere. Sure, trains are practical where civilization lives, but it’s just far too rural for trains here.
it says “urban transportation”
I wonder how a train is picking up my walking disabled mother from three Kilometres afar?
Will a train stop at my house to pick up my some two tons of gardening scraps per year?
At which time will it deliver my 100kg of groceries per week?
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Accessible trains that cover long distances (particularly high-speed rail) with trains that have floors at the level of the platform, like any European country with a competent public transport system. “Your mother” could also use something like a microcar to get to the station, which is allowed on bike lanes in the Netherlands as long as she can prove she has a disability.
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No, but your sons would have an easier and safer time getting around with protected bike lanes, which is precisely why parents in the Netherlands never have to do school runs.
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Your groceries will get to you faster the less unneccessary road users are there due to less induced demand. Do you honestly think countries that heavily rely on public transport don’t have businesses that use the road regularly? Do you honestly think they have no emergency services (ambulances, firetrucks, police cars)? Have you actually thought about examples of how countries that actually exist using good public transport amenities and dense housing operate? Or are you just against change?
You meticulously avoided all hard questions. No problem, I just repeat them for you:
I wonder how a train is picking up my walking disabled mother from three Kilometres afar?
Will a train stop at my house to pick up my some two tons of gardening scraps per year?
At which time will it deliver my 100kg of groceries per week?
Also, How does a long distance train help my mother to get the 3km to her doctor?
How does a train help me buying building materials? Last week I bought 400kg of tiles. One drive with a car. It would have taken ten travels with a train if the train did stop inside the hardware store and directly in front of my house. Delivery by truck would have cost €50.
A “micro car” is not only insanely expensive, it also has no room for my mothers wheelchair.
My country has one of the best public transport systems in the western world. Everything you mention is available here. We can drive EVERYWHERE for a €49 flat rate and we have three bus stops within 100 metres. Still that doesn’t help to solve a single problem I mentioned earlier.
Oh, and spending €245 for a family trip in a train? Not gonna happen. With the car it is a €10 trip.
But there is a actually a solution which could work: Robotaxis at very low prices per km. It wouldn’t lower the traffic but reduce the parked cars and the TCO of personal transport.
Please give me moar bullshittery to mock you. It is fun.
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![[meme] Trains -- not driverless cars -- are the future of transportation](https://lemmy.world/pictrs/image/f6468af5-8151-4b4c-b339-2fa0b0373c3a.webp){kind=link}