It’s happening again!
The DMA should never have allowed Apple any oversight of apps distributed outside their store.
I don’t think this is distributed outside their store, flashlight man.
Epic was planning to distribute it in its own store in the EU.
flashlight man.
I’ll take it.
Wish people cared this much when Epic shutdown the servers for the Unreal Tournament games.
You’re smart enough to know this is nothing like that because you are old enough to have played UT
Doesn’t change that I wish people cared more about when companies shutdown games that they paid for. It cost Epic pennies to keep the master servers running.
SailFishOS looking real good right now
Honestly Fortnite mobile wasn’t very enjoyable to begin with
they big mad they can’t tax it?
Didn’t they just have a court thing saying its illegal for apple to do so?
That title sounds redundant. “Apple banned fortnite. People are reporting that it’s banned.”
I surmised that people are more than just reporting the ban. They seem to be highlighting the unfair hand of Apple preventing them from doing what they want on their device
So they’re wilfully ignoring the EU’s Digital Markets Act and a US court-ordered injunction that prevents them from punishing developers for trying to circumvent the use of the App Store for in-app purchases, after one of their execs was caught lying under oath and potentially facing criminal repercussions.
I’m not the biggest fan of Epic Games, but I really want to see this backfire spectacularly. Apple’s business practices are so bad that it makes me want to see Tim Sweeney kick Tim Cook’s ass in court.
I can’t believe I’m cheering for Sweeney even once, but I guess it works out for all of us in this case.
I personally always root for the underdog when I have no stake. I thank epic for the free games I play on my steam deck, used to have an iPhone but transitioned to a Linux phone fairly early, and not a fan of either company’s current director.
People buying Apple products want to be told by Apple what’s allowed. The walled garden is core to Apple’s product philosophy. It’s not like everybody was expecting Apple to be super open and inclusive with anything and then be taken by surprise from the Fortnite situation. Even before they deprecated open standards because their own tech is supposedly evolving faster and are better integrated.
People wanting to play Fortnite on phones can just get a reasonably specced Android phone and install EGS next to Play Store with just a few taps.
People buying Apple products want to be told by Apple what’s allowed.
I get that this crowd generally thinks Apple is hellspawn, in spite of also having devices made by other, also shitty corporations, but this is just a dumb thing to say. They’re just devices. Yes some of us prefer them. I didn’t switch after every mainline Android phone from G1 through Nexus and Pixel because I wanted a paternal imposition of allowed apps. Stupid fucking comment.
No, apple is a piece of shit for not allowing you to flash whatever firmware you want on there. It makes my job harder and no one wants to do ios pentesting because of that.
I hope that apple burns to hell.
I don’t disagree with any of that. I only take issue with the quoted statement.
Stupid fucking comment.
I was merely stating in simple words what Apple’s product is and that their customers respond to exactly that. You choice of words shows that a loud fraction of their user base is a cult, though.
What are you on about? What you said simply is not true. At least, I’ve not once heard an Apple user state they wanted to be told what they were allowed to use. You either believe that, which would be stupid, or you don’t which would be disingenuous. You pick.
It may be a scumbag company, or its users a cult, but that doesn’t stop what you said from being stupid.
I’ve yet to hear anyone in republican cities say they want a king, yet they keep on voting for it.
Eh, not really. I buy Apple because I’ve had 3 Android phones crap out on me literally days after their warranty died. I got tired of that shit, I paid a bit more and got myself an iPhone 13. It still works as good as it did on the first day. While I do know that Apple devices have a set death day (when they stop getting security updates), I believe I generate far less e-waste by buying 1 iPhone every 7 or 8 years instead of buying a brand new Android every year.
As far as Fortnite goes, I don’t care for the game itself, but I am happy that they fought Apple in court and gave developers the freedom to implement third party IAP, albeit I have no use for it as I only use my phone for phone calls and messaging and the occasional web browsing.
What a disingenuous arguement.
You said you paid more for an iPhone, which means you were buying cheap Android phones and then complaining that they don’t last. Well yeah, because they’re cheap.
You can buy Android phones that make iPhones look like the budget option if you want to, I’m not advising it but it’s possible.
I’d say even cheap Androids can last long: Samsung A series receive 4 OS updates and after updates are over, you can get a few more years with last supported OS until battery or app compatibility becomes a problem.
It was one S21, S22 and a Pixel 5 or 6. I didn’t overpay for the mux delux version, just the basic one.
Not necessarily. iPhones used to be more than pretty much every Android flagship phone.
buying a brand new android every year
We’ve had wildly different experiences with these companies, for what it’s worth.
I bought an iPhone X back when they were new, and had to get it replaced twice within the first 6 months because of hardware failures.
Conversely, I kept my Pixel 3 (from 2019) until last year.
That’s how stuff works. Different people have different experiences. I had to get my pixel 3 replaced twice under warranty for a known screen issue. The pixel 7a, believe it is, is currently in the middle of a mass battery failure issue that really should end in a recall, where they’re refunding people often more than they even paid for the phone when it happens. Every flagship pixel up until the 5 had major hardware issues.
iPhones have, historically, been the best phones you could get in terms of being built to last, which is also why Apple have such long software support for them.
Which Android phones did you have?
S21, S22 and a Pixel 5 or 6. The latter was the one to break the camel’s break.
Predicting a classic tale of comparing apple flagships to $150 android phones.
I had a MacBook, while I was typing on it, suddenly just turn off, never to be turned on again. Took it to the store, they told me it was cheaper to buy a new one.
I had a similar experience and this is what made me switch away from Apple computers.
I only use my phone for phone calls and messaging and the occasional web browsing.
Why not use a feature phone, then? Cheaper, more repairable, and the Nokia ones will also last longer.
Android is an operating system. It has nothing to do with crappy hardware. At least they’re somewhat repairable when they do break.
I think iPhones have one of the best iFixit repairability scores among popular smartphones. The current iPhone 16 Pro scores 7/10, while the Pixel 9 Pro and S25 Ultra only achieve 5/10. Parts - first or third party - are broadly available.
Those scores are simply nonsense and do not account for the parts pairing bullshit. They gave them 7s a couple years ago, then dropped to 4 after public outcry, then just went back to 7s again with no explanation.
Other manufacturers did/do parts pairing as well.
Apple also removed a couple of roadblocks for third party parts and you can pair replacement parts on device now.
Is it perfect? No. My point is simply that most other major smartphone manufacturers are no better (remember Google’s Pixel 4a battery performance program?). But around these parts people seem to be prejudiced and maybe have outdated information. I just feel like it’s more of a “pick your poison” instead of a “grass is greener on the other side”.
Well then I stand both shocked and delightfully corrected, thank you.
They targeted gamers.
Gamers.
We’re a group of people who will sit for hours, days, even weeks on end performing some of the hardest, most mentally demanding tasks. Over, and over, and over all for nothing more than a little digital token saying we did.
We’ll punish our selfs doing things others would consider torture, because we think it’s fun.
We’ll spend most if not all of our free time min maxing the stats of a fictional character all to draw out a single extra point of damage per second.
Many of us have made careers out of doing just these things: slogging through the grind, all day, the same quests over and over, hundreds of times to the point where we know evety little detail such that some have attained such gamer nirvana that they can literally play these games blindfolded.
Do these people have any idea how many controllers have been smashed, systems over heated, disks and carts destroyed 8n frustration? All to latter be referred to as bragging rights?
These people honestly think this is a battle they can win? They take our media? We’re already building a new one without them. They take our devs? Gamers aren’t shy about throwing their money else where, or even making the games our selves. They think calling us racist, mysoginistic, rape apologists is going to change us? We’ve been called worse things by prepubescent 10 year olds with a shitty head set. They picked a fight against a group that’s already grown desensitized to their strategies and methods. Who enjoy the battle of attrition they’ve threatened us with. Who take it as a challange when they tell us we no longer matter. Our obsession with proving we can after being told we can’t is so deeply ingrained from years of dealing with big brothers/sisters and friends laughing at how pathetic we used to be that proving you people wrong has become a very real need; a honed reflex.
Gamers are competative, hard core, by nature. We love a challange. The worst thing you did in all of this was to challange us. You’re not special, you’re not original, you’re not the first; this is just another boss fight.
GAmErS rIsE Up!
bottom text
Gonna disagree there, gamers can’t give up pre-ordering games through studios that regularly bait and switch and throwing money at the biggest AAA studios.
We live in a society
Bottom text
Of course we do. We’re not animals.
If you don’t want to be called racist misogynist rape apologists don’t be racist, misogynist, or apologize for rape. Pretty simple. Gamers are not actually an oppressed identity my guy. Nobody is out to get you.
I don’t know whether you’ve been alive during the “games make people violent” craze, where the establishment was trying to pin school shootings on a harmless hobby: The same establishment which caused the systemic issues driving youth into desperation was now blaming an escapist hobby for the issues they, themselves, caused. It’s like framing jugglers for knife attacks. Do some jugglers juggle knives? Yes. Does that have anything to do with anything? No.
Is that in any way comparable in scale and intensity to what various groups had to go through historically, or are now, no of course not. But gamers, as a wider culture, know what it’s like to be victim-blamed. The average person who picks up playing games as a hobby is not any more racist, misogynist, or drivelling rape apologia than the population average. They do it because they enjoy it, no further qualifications necessary.
But OTOH, nope. The copypasta is pumped-up to 11 when it comes to the capacity of gamers to be a community, to organise, take joint action, be a force, everything. I’d be easy to go “no true gamer” on some people but face it “gamers” as a group are still pre-ordering games and letting GPU scalpers have their way with us. Just as powerless as, say, football fans are powerless in he face of FIFA corruption. Concert goes in the face of ticket platform monopolies. We’re a hopeless case in any other aspect but whinging: That, we are masters of.
Is this a copy pasta? If it weren’t for the 1 typo (8n), I’d swear this is a copy pasta. If it’s not already, I’m definitely saving it and making it one. Nice pasta, bro
It’s a copy pasta, either reddit or 4chan
It’s copy pasta, I’ve seen it before.
It definitely should be a copypasta, if it isn’t already. It has all of the right makings of a copypasta.
Keep it up Apple, keep pissing off the gamers. Shrink that monopoly. Seems pretty fucking insane that they can stop an app from working remotely. If an app that is being used to coordinate a rebellion takes off the US government can order Apple to disable its use. I hope the degoogling Android trend takes off further.
They targeted gamers.
Gamers.
We’re a group of people who will sit for hours, days, even weeks on end performing some of the hardest, most mentally demanding tasks. Over, and over, and over all for nothing more than a little digital token saying we did.
We’ll punish our selfs doing things others would consider torture, because we think it’s fun.
We’ll spend most if not all of our free time min maxing the stats of a fictional character all to draw out a single extra point of damage per second.
Many of us have made careers out of doing just these things: slogging through the grind, all day, the same quests over and over, hundreds of times to the point where we know evety little detail such that some have attained such gamer nirvana that they can literally play these games blindfolded.
Do these people have any idea how many controllers have been smashed, systems over heated, disks and carts destroyed 8n frustration? All to latter be referred to as bragging rights?
These people honestly think this is a battle they can win? They take our media? We’re already building a new one without them. They take our devs? Gamers aren’t shy about throwing their money else where, or even making the games our selves. They think calling us racist, mysoginistic, rape apologists is going to change us? We’ve been called worse things by prepubescent 10 year olds with a shitty head set. They picked a fight against a group that’s already grown desensitized to their strategies and methods. Who enjoy the battle of attrition they’ve threatened us with. Who take it as a challange when they tell us we no longer matter. Our obsession with proving we can after being told we can’t is so deeply ingrained from years of dealing with big brothers/sisters and friends laughing at how pathetic we used to be that proving you people wrong has become a very real need; a honed reflex.
Gamers are competative, hard core, by nature. We love a challange. The worst thing you did in all of this was to challange us. You’re not special, you’re not original, you’re not the first; this is just another boss fight.
I have a very particular set of skills…
If you’re trying to organise a rebellion via any privately owned company, you’re a fucking idiot.
Imagine if now, at the height of their success, Apple finally decided, for the first time, to alienate the core audience they’ve always shown undying dedication to: gamers /s
Yeah keep pissing off gamers. The pro consumer group that got lootboxes, battlepasses, denuvo, endless copy pastes and lazy remakes, nintendo and sony practises, shameless pay to win, day 1 on disk dlc, anti cheat that just blocks only linux users, not cheaters, kernel level anti cheat, ea and ubisoft clients on steam games and pay to win mechanics on already full priced games popular and successful.
Apple is NOT ready for the way gamers are going to make this practise normalized and profitable.
As a gamer I have very low respect for other gamers ability to organise any levels of resistance to shifty business practices.
How they actually spend their money never lies. They moan, but they still pre-order shit like gibbering apes.
Doubt I have paid full price for a AAA game in like a decade at this point. Not even many that I bought. Does shadow of mordor count? I got that at a massive discount ages after release. It was ok, but I would want my money back if I had paid full price.
It’s actually Epic’s fault this time. They pulled it from the EU app store.
They pulled all iOS versions because their iOS update couldn’t be approved in time (they’re live service and need simultaneous updates on all platforms) and “Apple has blocked our Fortnite submission so we cannot release to the US App Store or to the Epic Games Store for iOS in the European Union.”
Plus nobody playing Fortnite on an iPhone anyway
iPad
Removed by mod
Yes they are.
The article literally says they aren’t
At this very moment? No. In general? Yes.
At this very moment, no.
Finding it hard to sympathise with either of these dickhead corporations. Let 'em sue each other into bankruptcy for all I care.
There’s also Linux phones
Alright Chad… I don’t think the normie stream is ready for it haha
This is the year of linux desktop tho ✊
Neither are “normies” “ready” for degoogled Android.
Spoken like a true rebel. My respects.
GaMeRs aren’t going to do shit to Apple lol. Fortnite hasn’t been on iPhones for years and Apple hasn’t been hurt one bit.
If an app that is being used to coordinate a rebellion takes off the US government can……
lol
If an app that is being used to coordinate a rebellion takes off the US government can order Apple to disable its use. I hope the degoogling Android trend takes off further.
Apple already did this in Hong Kong to appease China. They took down apps that were used by protesters to coordinate, they even modified AirDrop so it couldn’t be easily used for ad hoc communication.
Epic is a piece of shit company. The only reason they are fighting this fight with Apple is because they want some of Apple’s platform fees for themselves. Period.
The fact that they managed to convince a bunch of simpletons that they are somehow Robin Hood coming to free them from the tyrant (who was actually protecting all those users all along) is laughable. Apple created the platform, Apple managed it, curated it, and controlled it. That gives them the right to profit from it. You might dislike that but — guess what? Nobody forced you to buy it. Buy Android if Fortnight is so important to you. Seriously. Please. We won’t miss you.
Epic thinks they have a right to profit from Apple’s platform and not pay them for all the work they did to get it to be over 1 billion users. That is simply wrong. They should build their own platform and their own App Store and convince 1 billion people to use it. The reason they aren’t doing that is because they know they will never be as successful as Apple has been.
their iPhone is preventing them from playing the game
Epic are the ones preventing Fortnite from being available on iPhones. They have no one to blame but themselves for the way they planned to intentionally break the App Store rules and had a lawsuit ready to go when it was rightly removed from the store.
They fucked around and found out.
Funny someone with your username would advocate for people who outright bought a piece of hardware to be controlled by the manufacturer in terms of what they can do with their device, while also forcefully taking an enormous cut of any transactions involving it.
Epic has forced Apple to give users more options, and that’s a good thing. Epic are usually the bad guys - this time they weren’t.
Epic intentionally broke the rules of the contract they agreed to, and had a lawsuit ready to go as soon as Apple rightfully removed their game from the store over the breach of contract. Epic were not the good guys.
You guys need to get this idea out of your head that the makers of the device that you bought need to provide ways for you to do what you want with it. They don’t, and any attempt to force them to write software to do so should be denied.
You can do whatever the hell you like with your hardware. Take it apart, take it fishing, try and hack it, have sex with it - whatever you want! But the device makers aren’t responsible for giving you ways to hack it.
You guys need to get this idea out of your head that the makers of the device that you bought need to provide ways for you to do what you want with it. They don’t, and any attempt to force them to write software to do so should be denied.
You can do whatever the hell you like with your hardware. Take it apart, take it fishing, try and hack it, have sex with it - whatever you want! But the device makers aren’t responsible for giving you ways to hack it.
You’re looking at this the wrong way.
We do not expect Apple/Google/Samsung/etc to give us tools to do whatever we want. Hell, Google already ships
adbthat explicitly allows unlocking the bootloader on at least Pixel devices.What we do want is for companies to stop intentionally preventing it with arbitrary restrictions that amount to nothing more than “because we said so”.
That’s fine to want, but you’re not entitled to it and never should be.
When did I ever say I was entitled to it?
Furthermore, why are you so eager to lick corporate boot over this? Just accept the fact that corps are fucking consumers over by trying to redefine terms like “purchase” and “own” to mean something other than their existing widely-accepted definitions.
If I buy an expensive piece of hardware, I do expect to be able to own it and install what I goddamn well please, corporate approval be damned. That’s why I buy Pixels and standard PC hardware, because I can unlock the bootloader/disable secure boot and install what I goddamn well please. Can’t do that with any iPhone, and rarely a Mac, because it goes against what Daddy Apple hath decreed.
Additionally, it is also acceptable to acknowledge the former and simultaneously acknowledge that Epic is a shitty company. They aren’t mutually exclusive.
I was about to give a genuine reply, then I read your second sentence and now I realize there’s no point. Straight to the tired old garbage “boot licker” insults. Have fun.
I have a genuine question:
How does arguing in support of arguably bad business practices in general benefit you?
What are the “arguably bad business practices” here? I would argue that Epic pissing off the manufacturer of the most popular phones in the world, which have over 90% of all in-app purchase $$$$ spent in the mobile world, is bad business practice - not even arguably.
As for anything “benefiting me”……am I not allowed an opinion or to express it unless it’s echo chamber aligned? Is it only allowed if it ignores all logic and is just mindless anger against [insert big corporation name here]?
I’m giving context to the situation.
Lol, siding with apple here is a bootlicker thing to do.
You guys need to find a new name to call people.
Epic were the bad guys in this scenario. Why are you licking the boot of epic?
Why is anybody licking big corporate boot in the first place? How does that benefit you?
I wasn’t “licking big corporate boot” in the first place. I said that epic have no one but themselves to blame, which is true. I said if epic did to me what they did to Apple, I’d tell them to get fucked if they ever tried to put stuff on my store again.
No bootlicking at all, but that doesn’t stop some losers from throwing out the term because they hate company X. Apple built a product, and they’re entitled to make it a closed ecosystem. We, as consumers, are entitled to not buy or use their products if we don’t like them, their policies, etc.
People vote with their wallets, and unfortunately for the Apple haters, the votes keep coming up Apple no matter how many recounts there are. Android is right there as an alternative and lets you do basically whatever you want with it, yet outside of third world countries the iPhone rules the roost.
If you care about freedom, use open source operating systems, and only buy hardware that support it.
Epic isn’t wrong about Apples payment requirements being BS, but Epic also isn’t exactly a hero here.
Will be interesting to see how this pissing match plays out over time.
Should you be able to use other payment providers outside of apple pay YES!
Should you be able to install other APP stores on an iPhone? Not sure.
Why shouldn’t you be able to install whatever you want? Maybe I’m missing something…
I am in the camp that there is a benefit to the managed store. Since moving family members to iOS devices the number of times they have loaded malware or asked me for help installing ANYTHING dropped to zero.
Should techies be able to side load if they want? Sure, should that be a primary install method? No.
There is a benefit. And you can continue using the first-party store if you want. There’s no benefit to not being able to use 3rd-party ones to anyone but Apple and their investors.
Monopolies and trusts are never beneficial to anyone save those who control them.
All bootloaders should be able to be unlocked and able to install the OS of your choice. Also you should be able to choose whatever app store you want. It is your hardware, you payed for it.
ICE has been notified, nice try, domestic terrorist
Good thing i’m Canadian then, lol.
If you want a customizable phone, yes. If you want a secured phone, no.
There are already existing products for both sides. No point in forcing them to do something else at this point.
Except Google is trying to limit this on Android phones as well (e.g. with SafetyNet).
If manufacturers had their way, there wouldn’t be any phones for one side.
I mean that’s something that’d happen regardless of whether you may install other App Stores on an iPhone easily, no?
GP wrote:
All bootloaders should be able to be unlocked and able to install the OS of your choice. Also you should be able to choose whatever app store you want. It is your hardware, you payed for it.
App stores are just one part of the puzzle. Unless consumers actually have rights, manufacturers will keep trying to limit their options.
If manufacturers had their way, there wouldn’t be any phones for one side.
There’s nothing stopping manufacturers from permanently locking the bootloader. Some do and others don’t suggesting that the industry does not have a universal preference.
I do think Google wants it to be inconvenient enough to run a version of Android they haven’t blessed as one’s main phone that it has no chance to become mainstream, but that’s about the prospect of an OEM not bundling Google’s apps and store, not hobbyists running custom builds. If that sounds like an attempt to use market power to exclude competitors in violation of fair trading laws in a multitude of jurisdictions, you might be on to something.
There’s nothing stopping manufacturers from permanently locking the bootloader. Some do and others don’t suggesting that the industry does not have a universal preference.
Some manufacturers have stopped allowing unlocking their bootloaders, some bootloaders have been hacked by the community. It’s not like this is a static system.
I do think Google wants it to be inconvenient enough to run a version of Android they haven’t blessed as one’s main phone that it has no chance to become mainstream, but that’s about the prospect of an OEM not bundling Google’s apps and store, not hobbyists running custom builds.
No, Google is also trying to stop hobbyists running custom builds from accessing services built on their software (the aforementioned SafetyNet). Hackers keep finding ways around this, but Google keeps trying to lock them out.
Apple’s software is malware
How so?
I can see benefits of such limitations for say a company-owned devices with cyber-security in mind. When we talk about open market of devices in an increasingly “digital” world I am against limitations with profit in mind. It’s like many things in life. When you want to do or use something you have to learn to use it, often by getting burned or otherwise making a mistake. You having to fix family devices has nothing to do with it. Anyway I have no stake in this, I would never buy an Apple device. Companies pushing for “infinite growth” with such policies will be left in the dust imo, but the billionares will just move on after milking everything dry.
There’s a lot of very techy people who’ve never had to do family tech support on this platform.
Yes, the fact that Mum can’t accidentally install a shitty browser toolbar is a feature.
“I frequently interface with idiots, so I don’t feel it would be safe for you to have full control over the hardware you own.”
Nope. No reason that you should pay $1000 for a device and not, at the very least, be able to install compatible software from other sources.
We wouldn’t accept this from Microsoft. Could you imagine if this was the norm for DOS or Windows?
Should side loading be discouraged and warned about? Yes. Should it be impossible? Maybe through “parental” controls or MDM, but absolutely not out-of-the-box.
This is a sane take, though I personally do generally tend towards understanding and even valuing the walled garden to some degree. But this is what I’ve always felt underneath it, you found the words.
A walled garden without an exit is just a pretty prison.
What’s more, Windows S Mode proved perfectly that you could offer the “safe” functionality that Apple claim they need to protect their customers, without fucking things up for people who wanted to take responsibility for vetting applications themselves.
You’re missing that you don’t make the OS, and the OS maker doesn’t have to make a way for you to be able to install whatever you want. Sony doesn’t let you install Switch games on your PS5, do they? Should they be forced to?
No. They can peddle their infinite growth with less people paying more rather than the opposite. This is the way I guess.
Ok so you agree that Sony shouldn’t have to let you install and play anything you want on their console, but Apple needs to be different because…….reasons? Reasons that you can’t articulate.
You missed some sarcasm in there. Once I buy a device, I can wipe it clean, remove any bloat application, load my own code, or side load my friends’ shitty home made game. It’s my device, not apples’. Especially when the device is like 2k€. Apple is responsible for their firmware, so device must run and work for me when I factory reset it. Factory code must be consumer friendly (In reality it’s a tracker and an ad peddler). Loosing guarantee is ok if I phisically modify the device.
You can try to do all that, sure - but Apple don’t have to enable you to do it, and they damn sure well don’t have to write software specifically so you can do it.
It’s your hardware, but you bought it with any restrictions they put on it and you’re under no entitlement for them to remove them.
You are just describing current landscape of corporate greed. So it’s my expensive device, running their telemetry and being a subject of their forced updates putting more and more restrictions and subscriptions on it’s use while they sell data on the side? All that and I can’t play a shitty but popular game on it? Sounds fun. (sarcasm again…) And no, I will not subscribe to the corporate shill mentality so stop trying.
You are missing the gene that makes one an apple fanBoi apparently.
