US president also to seek constitutional amendment to limit immunity for presidents and various officeholders

Joe Biden will announce plans to reform the US supreme court on Monday, Politico reported, citing two people familiar with the matter, adding that the US president was likely to back term limits for justices and an enforceable code of ethics.

Biden said earlier this week during an Oval Office address that he would call for reform of the court.

He is also expected to seek a constitutional amendment to limit immunity for presidents and some other officeholders, Politico reported, in the aftermath of a July supreme court ruling that presidents have broad immunity from prosecution.

Biden will make the announcement in Texas on Monday and the specific proposals could change, the report added.

  • Flying Squid@lemmy.world
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    5 months ago

    Biden will make the announcement in Texas on Monday

    Just twisting that knife in the wound. I love it.

        • ripcord@lemmy.world
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          5 months ago

          Right, but the phrase implies this is just taking something that is already hurting them and making it worse.

            • IronKrill@lemmy.ca
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              Can’t speak for ripcord, but the part I am unclear on is why Texas specifically is relevant. Is the supreme court based in Texas? I am not American.

              • zbyte64@awful.systems
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                5 months ago

                The 5th federal court district is in Texas and is notorious. Most recently they did some shenanigans to keep the federal government from enforcing it’s borders because Texas was playing politics with their troops and occupying federal land to put Razer wire in the border river.

              • tamal3@lemmy.world
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                5 months ago

                I’m from the US and I’m not following, either.

                The Supreme Court meets across the country in Washington DC, so it’s not for that reason.

        • aberrate_junior_beatnik@midwest.social
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          5 months ago

          Well, no, but there’s a big gap between “not helping” and “wounding”, and this is much, much closer to the “not helping” end of that gap.

  • Atom@lemmy.world
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    5 months ago

    InB4 “WhY DiDn’t hE Do iT WhEn hE HaD ThE MaJoRiTy?” Because he’s calling for constitutional amendments that require a 2/3rds support in Congress and the SCOTUS may finally be disliked enough to get some GOP members to support reform, especially if it comes with limiting Biden’s own immunity.

    • ulkesh@lemmy.world
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      5 months ago

      …and 3/4 of the states. Not only will it take years to accomplish, the uneducated people of the country won’t stand for any amendment that a “librul” came up with. And then everyone will forget or stop caring.

      There won’t be another amendment in the next fifty years, as long as MAGA morons exist.

      • ericatty@lemmy.ml
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        5 months ago

        This requirement is what stalls almost all constitutional changes. The last three to pass were 25th 1971 about voting rights for 18 year olds (100 days to pass) the 26th in 1967 about presidential succession (just under 3 years to pass) The last last one (27th) was added 1992 after almost 203 years of meeting the other requirements (It has to do with sitting Congress not being able to raise their own salaries, increases are delayed to the next term. )

        There are 6 amendments still sitting out there awaiting ratification by the states.

    • Drunemeton@lemmy.world
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      5 months ago

      His first year:

      1. The American Rescue Plan Act and extending existing Covid-19 programs
      2. Infrastructure Investment and Jobs Act
      3. Bills to avoid a government shutdown and keep the federal government running
      4. Juneteenth National Independence Day Act
      5. Uyghur Forced Labor Prevention Act
    • aberrate_junior_beatnik@midwest.social
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      5 months ago

      I mean the critique behind “why didn’t he do it when he had the majority” still applies: calling for a constitutional amendment is ineffectual. There’s no way a constitutional amendment is going to happen in today’s political environment.

      Also the court reform he’s proposing isn’t a constitutional amendment, but since he waited until he didn’t have a majority, that can’t happen either.

      It’s almost like he doesn’t want change.

      • Jiggle_Physics@lemmy.world
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        5 months ago

        Had he done that, it would have been before this blatant level of corruption had surfaced. So it would have been met with with “there is no evidence to merit something this drastic”.

      • Burn_The_Right@lemmy.world
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        5 months ago

        Manchin and Sinema would have blocked it. Our “majority” in the Senate existed only for legislation those two DINOs would allow.

  • oyo@lemm.ee
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    5 months ago

    To be clear, this immunity obviously DOES NOT EXIST in the constitution and was invented out of whole cloth.

    • wischi@programming.dev
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      5 months ago

      It’s not like the constitution is some infallible magic text, it was also “invented” by some dudes.

      • Taako_Tuesday@lemmy.ca
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        It was also, at least according to Jefferson, intended to be replaced on a regular basis to better reflect the needs of the country.

        • FireTower@lemmy.world
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          5 months ago

          Jefferson did write he wanted it remade every ~20 years. But that was a personal belief of his not the general understanding when the constitution was adopted.

      • Tryptaminev@lemm.ee
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        5 months ago

        While technically true, countries with a proper constitution that is upheld by the judiciary, legislative and executive branch of government tend to be much more stable.

        It is good to amend the constitution if necessary, but the principle of there being a constitution and it being followed, is a very important thing for democracy.

        • wischi@programming.dev
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          5 months ago

          I guess that’s true and I certainly don’t have anything against the concept of a constitution, but as someone not living in the US I find it pretty strange that so many Americans treat the constitution like some holy religious text.

      • Zink@programming.dev
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        That’s true, but I don’t think it invalidates anything about the post you replied to. It’s not a question of who invented what. The case is that the job of the founders WAS to invent the constitution and the structure of the government and all that.

        The second group’s job is to read what they wrote and follow it. And sometimes there’s wiggle room in interpretation and settling that is their job too. But they don’t get to make up new laws and amendments just because the result of doing so is desirable for them.

      • FireTower@lemmy.world
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        There’s also the question of how a law that would criminalize an enumerated power could be constitutional as applied as. That’d be voiding the Constitution by statute rather than amendment.

        Which would require the president to sign off on but could be weaponized against an incoming president if one party has the legislature and executive.

    • 4lan@lemmy.world
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      5 months ago

      What if we just made the limit 1 term? Then no presidents would be doing actions purely to get reelected?

        • BigMacHole@lemm.ee
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          5 months ago

          Thomas is still there because taking Bribes and Gifts from Billionaires who have Cases before you is FINE! The REAL Corruption is Judge MERCHAN’S DAUGHTER who DONATED some Money once to DEMOCRATS!

      • prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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        5 months ago

        Would be so much worse… Think about any type of project or policy that takes more than 4 years to complete (and longer to see tangible benefits from).

        It’s already bad enough having a GOP president come in every 8 years to undo most of the good things their Democratic predecessor accomplished (with Reagan removing Carter’s solar panels from the White House roof being the archetype).

        Imagine having that pendulum swing every 4 years. Literally nothing that takes longer than 4 years would ever get done.

        • prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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          5 months ago

          Mexico is in a very different situation regarding the size and complexity of their administrative state. They’re also facing an entirely different type of corruption and political violence than we have up here…

          • nik9000@programming.dev
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            5 months ago

            Yeah! Every place I saw that did it seemed quite different from the US. I just thought it was neat that there are places trying this.

    • ChickenLadyLovesLife@lemmy.world
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      5 months ago

      He is also expected to seek a constitutional amendment

      Arguably, this is still pussyfooting since there’s no fucking way he has anything near the number of votes needed for this.

      • prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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        Whenever I see a politician mention anything about a constitutional amendment, I immediately stop reading.

        Shit ain’t happening… We wouldn’t be able to pass an amendment saying “Pizza is yummy” because Republicans would refuse to agree with Democrats. They would actually stop eating pizza altogether because of it. There would be a movement to outlaw pizza because it’s grooming our kids (stupid sexy pizza).

        I was trying to think of something silly and outlandish, and as I was typing this, I realized… This isn’t even that far out of the realm of possibility at this point. It’s like legitimately difficult to think of something too far-fetched for this reality. It wouldn’t be the first pizza-related issue on the right (ahem, Pizzagate?). Or the second (I just remembered the stupid “pizza is a vegetable” bullshit).

        The looking glass ain’t shit, we went through it years ago. We’re at the end of “2001: A Space Odyssey” with Pink Floyd’s Echoes playing in sync with it. If we’re lucky, we’ll soon make it through the psychedelic spaghettification, and we will get to watch ourselves as a boring old man before becoming a giant space fetus…

        Sorry, got kind of sidetracked there what were we talking about again?

        Oh yeah, Jupiter and beyond the infinite…

        (Spoiler alert? Lol I couldn’t spoil the end of that film if I tried).

        • ChickenLadyLovesLife@lemmy.world
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          5 months ago

          I just remembered the stupid “pizza is a vegetable” bullshit

          I think you’re thinking of Reagan’s “ketchup is a vegetable” bullshit.

            • ChickenLadyLovesLife@lemmy.world
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              5 months ago

              The bill also would allow tomato paste on pizzas to be counted as a vegetable, as it is now.

              TBF that’s not even as bad as Reagan’s “ketchup is a vegetable”. Canning is a totally legitimate way of preserving tomatoes at their peak of ripeness with their nutritional qualities intact (many chefs even prefer canned tomatoes to fresh ones) and paste/sauce is just the ground-up version of that. Ketchup is that plus a shit ton of sugar and/or corn syrup.

              The amount of tomato sauce on pizza is dubiously small, however.

              • prole@lemmy.blahaj.zone
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                5 months ago

                It was more about the conservative reaction to the situation. Because it was during Obama tenure, and Michelle had the gall to get all uppity and try to make kids more healthy.

    • VinnyDaCat@lemmy.world
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      5 months ago

      Not entirely sure that matters here.

      I really don’t think there’s that many people towards the middle or left of the political spectrum that are going to be upset about this if he gets the changes through.

      Besides, any changes that might bother voters will still have an effect on Kamala’s campaign until the elections over in November.

  • Hildegarde@lemmy.world
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    5 months ago

    The problem is not presidential immunity. The problem is immunity and the president is just the highest profile job that has it. Politicians never do anything about the root cause, and only treat the symptoms.

    Police officers get away with murder because their job gives them immunity. Ceos, shareholders and other corporate staff have immunity as well.

    A president getting away with assassinating a political rival is just as unjust as letting a ceo get away with killing 346 people simply because their job gives them immunity for their actions.

    • turmacar@lemmy.world
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      5 months ago

      Perfect should not be the enemy of Good. Reforming the entire system is not something that just happens. It takes several steps in the right direction and you have to start somewhere.

      • RubyRhod@lemm.ee
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        The entire system is beyond antiquated. Coupled with bureaucratic tendency to be self serving, leads me to believe “reformation” will look more like slow death, and further declining services.

        I see no reason for optimism along the lines of “system reform”, and history has no examples I can think of. Shit just gets worse and worse till people start killing people and try some new systems.

        • turmacar@lemmy.world
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          Suffrage didn’t require violent overthrow of the entire system, neither did the New Deal, neither did the Civil Rights movement, neither did Medicare, neither did Gay Rights. No nothing is “solved”, but everything is better than it was in 1900.

          “IDK, maybe War will fix it” is far more unhelpful than working to make positive changes.

          • Ensign_Crab@lemmy.world
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            Ah, yes. The famously incrementalist New Deal and Medicare. The Civil Rights Movement? Incrementalism is setting a timetable for another man’s freedom. We only got gay marriage because the courts did what the legislature was too incrementalist to feel like doing.

          • RubyRhod@lemm.ee
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            Sufferage, civil rights etc aren’t institutions.

            'idk, war will fix it" is a lazy-ass takeaway, but ok.

            • turmacar@lemmy.world
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              You’re right, they’re fundamental changes across multiple institutions.

              “I can’t think of examples” is a pretty lazy justification for “the only way out is violence”.

  • Optional@lemmy.world
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    5 months ago

    It appears he’s pushing to add official ethics guidelines, not pack the court or anything that would radically change the fuckpit we’ve got now.

    Public confidence in the court has slipped sharply in recent years.

    lol

    • dropped_the_chief@lemmy.world
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      What’s he going to do? Remove kingly immunity from the presidency? Or how about use the senate to keep republicans from getting supreme Court nominees from even getting a hearing?

      • Bluefalcon@discuss.tchncs.de
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        You push an ethics review of the seating court. Make a solid case to impeach them if they did wrong. If you win the house and Senate with a majority then, you remove those that are extremely corrupt.

        Install term limits on the court as well. You correct the wrongs the Republicans have built in the last 20-30 years.

        • BluescreenOfDeath@lemmy.world
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          If you win the house and Senate with a majority then, you remove those that are extremely corrupt.

          Democrats would need a supermajority in the Senate to achieve that. Anything less than 2/3rds and nobody gets removed.

    • 4lan@lemmy.world
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      I think he should hire 15 more supreme Court justices. All 18 years old If they want to fuck around with our country we can too. Maybe that would lead to actual change in the rules surrounding supreme Court

  • dropped_the_chief@lemmy.world
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    5 months ago

    When the republican senate started weighing how to get their way through the supreme court, during the Obama administration, don’t sound so surprised the Democrats aren’t forced to go low too.